Measuring a bucks spread?

slcmuley · Jul 30, 2011

After all these years of reading posts I am now wondering which spread everyone is referring to while describing a buck .
Is it the inside or outside? Typically when I hear of a spread being over 28 I assume it's outside. I personally use inside spread since it is a measurement that can be used while scoring (of course the spread score cannot be more than the main beam length).
Also how are guys describing a buck with eyeguards? To me it's a 4 point with eyeguards. Are there guys calling this buck a 5 pt?

So while easterners count their points one way and we in the west see the cup as full as it really is, I just thought it would be time I get on the same page as everyone else, or those that are out of whack get their tune up here and now.

appleman · Jul 30, 2011

I think most everyone goes with outside spread?!

TOPGUN · Jul 30, 2011

Being from Michigan I call a whitetail with 5 on each sied including the eyes guards a 10 pointer and that's most do back in the east. On mulies I call a 4 on each side a 4x4 and then say with or without eye guards. I have always considered spread to be the inside measurement on both species. Obviously that can make a tremendous difference in spread if a buck has a 10 inch sticker going straight out and someone is using the outside as their spread!

sageadvice · Jul 30, 2011

It's always outside unless you're referring to the bucks score and then you say "inside".

No fair going crooked across the rack though, you got to measure square up, outside to outside.

Joey

liecabucks · Jul 30, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-11 AT 06:39PM (MST)[p]Well going off of your standings in the score contest it probably doesn't matter what your referring to. Just sayin

Sit tall in the saddle, hold your head up high, keep your eyes fixed to where the trail meets the sky...

sageadvice · Jul 30, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-11 AT 07:20PM (MST)[p]liecabucks said, "Well going off of your standings in the score contest it probably doesn't matter what your referring to. Just sayin"

That is right out of left field! Joking or not, saying stuff like that is exactly why a lot of members don't care to join in the contests. I'm glad you feel so good about yourself to be, "just sayin."

Joey

zekers · Jul 30, 2011

If I'm describing a buck, I'll say 28 inch wide 4 point. That's outside and not including eyeguards.

slcmuley · Jul 30, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-11 AT 07:58PM (MST)[p]"just saying" is a sissy way to stay out of a fight.

I did ok on some of the contests, and was way off on others. It really doesn't matter to me. Sure I would of liked to be in the top 5. I considered it a learning experience, and hey I won a cool video along the way.

-edit- this contest is where I learned the spread credit adjustment.
I guesbi should feel like I'm special if you are paying attention to my overall standing in the contest, just sayin ;-)

never_satisfied · Jul 30, 2011

If your talking about muley's regardless of the state
Its should always be there out side spread
And eye guards are a free point so to say.Not all muley's have them unlike most whitetails.
So If its a 4x4 with 20" eye guards its still a 4x4.If its a 4x4 without eye guards Its still a 4x4

txhunter58 · Jul 30, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-11 AT 08:51PM (MST)[p]I describe my best muley as a 29" 8x7. That measures outside width of the mainframe and browtines are included in that description. Had to since he has double eye guards on both sides! However, if he would have had a point sticking straight out wider than the mainframe, I would not include that in the width.

To me that is the best way to describe to someone else what your deer looks like. That best describes to someone what he looks like when viewed from the front and doesn't penalize him with a shorter inside width when he has a really thick mainframe. Otherwise two bucks both with an inside spread of 24", one with an mainframe outside of 26" and another with an outside mainframe of 28" sound the same.

Now, scoring him is another matter altogether.....

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

gb22 · Jul 30, 2011

Only recently has anyone (in the west) included eye guards. I have a 29 1/2 inch 4 point. It's actually got three eye guards on each side. It would never have occurred to my dad or uncles to say it was a 7 point (14 back east).

Not that it matters (I like Jack O'Connor's statement about judging game animals..."you can tell the big ones, because they look big".) but in B&C scoring, would I get credit or deducts for 3 eye guards on each side? Anyone know?

Within the shadows, go quietly.

booner76 · Jul 30, 2011

After all these years.........you guy's still cant agree on the western count and spread LOL!!!
Here in WI, where the whitetails are bigger than most of your Western Mule deer, it is considered a disgrace to measure antlers on the outside, only guy's with little weiners measure whitetails on the outside. I along with every dude from the east has no idea what we are supposed to call a mule deer with a rear fork and a front fork along with the little "Brow Tines" that mule deer sometimes grow. To me if it is a scorable point, why in the hell wouldnt you include it in your count meaning the deer I just discribed would be a 5x5, and if you want to tell people how wide the stupid thing is, why wouldnt you measure from the inside, where it count's, you guy's in the west must be just like the rest of us in the east, hung like stud field mice. Please understand there is absolutely no seriousness in this post. LOL

slcmuley · Jul 30, 2011

Boner-
Why inpm the hell are to readIng western posts anyays? I have to agree with you the eastern way to describe a whitetail buck is the easiest, and it has been that way for years.
I have to argue all day long that whites are superior to mule deer in regards to their appearance and how they are hunted, let Lone their antler size superiority.
And yes I read your last line which should disregard your entire post.
Thanks for posting (or not really?).

booner76 · Jul 31, 2011

Did you just call me "Boner"???

booner76 · Jul 31, 2011

As far as how they are hunted and how they look....I agree with you, if I didnt I would probably be on the gay whitetail site....Right?
I havent gone back and read what I posted, but all I remember saying was that the Whitetails here in WI seem to be bigger than most of the muley's I have seen killed out west....I stand by that "ALL DAY".

springbear · Jul 31, 2011

On a Whitetail, I always refer to the spread as "inside" unless there is a clear reason such as exceptional mass, layed out tines or a kicker, then I would qualify it as Outside....

On a Muley, I always expect any talk of spread to be outside, unless we are talking about a certified score sheet.

It is pretty "rare" for a whitetail to have much more of an outside spread than an inside. It is normaly just a couple of inches.

On a Muley, it is "common" even on a typical 4 by 4 "with eye guards" to have an outside spread that is substantially greater than the inside spread.

rmanwill · Jul 31, 2011

Outside spread and it's a four point with or without eyegaurds!!!

booner76 · Jul 31, 2011

Just so I understand, Mule deer typically have a larger difference than a whitetail as far as inside spread compared to outside because they are generally more massive? Because of the way the tines can come off the main beam???
Some of you guy's seem a little touchy so I will try and be as non-confrontational as I possibly can, I dont understand why you would think that, but I do understand that I dont know everything either so....teach me.

huntindad4 · Jul 31, 2011

Outside, except on a score sheet and a 4 point is a 4 point with or without the eyeguards.

I don't really care how easterners measure whitetails or mulies when they kill one. Whitetails are deer? Seem more like livestock to me.LOL

Bill

Look out Forkie, FTW is watching us!

slcmuley · Jul 31, 2011

Sorry boner was a typo.
I was just poking fun back.
Whitetails carry a superior gene and are more aggressive. To me the looks and ways of hunting mulies are far superior to whitetails, let alone the minimum antler requirements needed to be acknowledged in the record books.

So if I am understanding the majority here; it's a 4 pt with or without eyeguards, and the outside spread is used while describing it. If it's a nontypical you would count all points including eyeguards, but not use a horizontal kicker while describing the outside spread.
It seems a little wishy washy still. Can we at least agree that we describe a bucks gross score and not net?

It's been fun to see the responses on this.

sageadvice · Jul 31, 2011

Contrary to some opinions, kickers, stickers, trash, and drops, all count when measuring outside spread. Outside spread is just that. The farthest bone out from one side to the farthest of the other when measured straight across squared up. The exception to this is when you are only talking about the deer's mainframe, stickers and such would be excluded.

I too don't care how easterners measure, count, or even hunt their deer. Whitetails are fine i guess but i don't care to hunt them and this site is not called "Monster Whitetails"!

Joey

ridgetops · Jul 31, 2011

I always am talking about outside spread and if the buck has cheaters sticking out then I'll say it's farthest outside width, then explain what I think it's mainframe width is also. Example: I saw a buck that was a 6x8 that was 35" wide but had a 28" 180" class mainframe. Now I just need to get some pictures of such a buck. lol

There's always next year

liecabucks · Jul 31, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jul-31-11 AT 09:59PM (MST)[p]Sorry to bunch up anyones panties! Life is too short to take everything so personal and serious for hell sakes. EVERYONE uses outside cuz it makes things sound THAT MUCH BIGGER! P.S I didn't do so hot on a few of those contests either

......oh wait I'm not trying to cover up an internet fight should I leave the smiley face out?!

Sit tall in the saddle, hold your head up high, keep your eyes fixed to where the trail meets the sky...

swbuckmaster · Aug 1, 2011

I use the b&c method of field scoring deer. G1's are points! I don't know why anyone would not include them.

So I will say outside spread to furthest cheater. I will count every point.

I will then rack bracket and guess the final gross score. Nets are for fish.

I find Rednecks say 4x4 plus eyeguards.

T264 · Aug 1, 2011

>LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-11
>AT 08:51?PM (MST)
>
>I describe my best muley as
>a 29" 8x7. That
>measures outside width of the
>mainframe and browtines are included
>in that description. Had
>to since he has double
>eye guards on both sides!
> However, if he would
>have had a point sticking
>straight out wider than the
>mainframe, I would not include
>that in the width.
>
>To me that is the best
>way to describe to someone
>else what your deer looks
>like. That best describes
>to someone what he looks
>like when viewed from the
>front and doesn't penalize him
>with a shorter inside width
>when he has a really
>thick mainframe. Otherwise two
>bucks both with an inside
>spread of 24", one with
>an mainframe outside of 26"
>and another with an outside
>mainframe of 28" sound the
>same.
>
>Now, scoring him is another matter
>altogether.....
>
>txhunter58
>
>venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore
>I am)

+1
T264

huntindad4 · Aug 1, 2011

I find Utard say 5x5!

LOL.

Bill

Look out Forkie, FTW is watching us!

txhunter58 · Aug 1, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Aug-01-11 AT 06:10PM (MST)[p]>Just so I understand, Mule deer
>typically have a larger difference
>than a whitetail as far
>as inside spread compared to
>outside because they are generally
>more massive? Because of the
>way the tines can come
>off the main beam???
>Some of you guy's seem a
>little touchy so I will
>try and be as non-confrontational
>as I possibly can, I
>dont understand why you would
>think that, but I do
>understand that I dont know
>everything either so....teach me.

Ok, my 29" mulie has an inside spread of 23 & 1/2 inches. He has great mass and his rear forks are significantly wider than the inside spread. Nuff said

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)

sageadvice · Aug 1, 2011

leicabucks, said, "Sorry to bunch up anyones panties! Life is too short to take everything so personal and serious for hell sakes"

That seems to be the basic generic answer in response here at MM after being called out on being thoughtless or offensive. Try, "you know, you're right... I shouldn't have said that"

I find it feels good to admit my mistakes. Maybe you will too in time.

Joey

AndymanSavage · Aug 8, 2011

I say we go back to the water displacement method for scoring all antlered game. The whole "deductions" thing is stupid to me..... The deer grew it, but it doesn't count? Lets not even go into how mass its treated...

I say spread is spread, how wide are his antlers? Why not count kickers? Do we now need to make deductions before we tell anyone anything about the deer? Lame.

-----------------------------------------------
http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/

overton · Aug 8, 2011

>I say we go back to
>the water displacement method for
>scoring all antlered game. The
>whole "deductions" thing is stupid
>to me..... The deer grew
>it, but it doesn't count?
>Lets not even go into
>how mass its treated...
>
>I say spread is spread, how
>wide are his antlers? Why
>not count kickers? Do we
>now need to make deductions
>before we tell anyone anything
>about the deer? Lame.
>
>-----------------------------------------------
>http://andymansavage.blogspot.com/

Exactly!

leftturnabq · Aug 10, 2011

>I use the b&c method of
>field scoring deer. G1's are
>points! I don't know why
>anyone would not include them.
>
>
>So I will say outside spread
>to furthest cheater. I will
>count every point.
>
>I will then rack bracket and
>guess the final gross score.
>Nets are for fish.
>
>I find Rednecks say 4x4 plus
>eyeguards.

>
>
>

Agreed.

A mature typical with browtines is a 5x5 to me. Any scoreable piece of bone beyond that counts as a non-typical point, but it counts...even if it had 5 browtines on one side. When I talk about spread I'm refereing to outside of the main frame.