Application question for Fall Draw

[Phinkle]

Since the 09-10 regulations are now out I want to get in before the correction period ends. My question is: can you put the same hunt number as your 1st and 2nd choice to increase your odds for the single hunt? Is this allowed?

 

[mesquitehunter]

nope

 

[ruthunter]

no!

 

[Phinkle]

>no!

Ok...while you guys were writing this I called the fish and game and they said yes. Hmmm...can someone else try calling and see if you get the same answer?

 

[krp]

They look at your first and give you a tag if there is one available, if they are all gone they go to your second, and again they would be all gone.

I wouldn't risk having them reject your app but if you're in the correction period, wouldn't hurt I guess.

I don't know how it would up your odds though.

Kent

 

[Phinkle]

I thought it was based upon the 1st, 2nd and 3rd pass with 20% of the applications going to the bonus points on the 1st pass and then the second pass, then finally the third. If you miss on the 1st (bonus point round), you can hit the same hunt on the 2nd pass. Am I wrong?

>They look at your first and
>give you a tag if
>there is one available, if
>they are all gone they
>go to your second, and
>again they would be all
>gone.
>
>I wouldn't risk having them reject
>your app but if you're
>in the correction period, wouldn't
>hurt I guess.
>
>I don't know how it would
>up your odds though.
>
>Kent

 

[ruthunter]

Not sure on that... i would think that the first choice would be gone by the time the second pass came around..

 

[HullinPhx]

There are a lot of smarter people on this site than me but AZ looks at your 1st and 2nd choice, then if those are not available it goes back into the bin and when you get picked again it looks at 3rd - 5th.

 

[redrabbit]

If you are only interested in one specific hunt, put it in as your first and only choice. Putting it in for first and second choices, will not increase your odds of drawing that hunt, except for one instance.

If you put different hunt numbers for first and second choice, there is a chance you may draw the second choice in the 20% bonus pass (if you have enough BP and do not draw the first choice). If you draw the 2nd choice in this bonus pass round, you would not be considered for the first choice in the second pass for the remaining 80% of the tags.

 

[Phinkle]

Thank you! That clears it up.

>If you are only interested in
>one specific hunt, put it
>in as your first and
>only choice. Putting it
>in for first and second
>choices, will not increase your
>odds of drawing that hunt,
>except for one instance.
>
>If you put different hunt numbers
>for first and second choice,
>there is a chance you
>may draw the second choice
>in the 20% bonus pass
>(if you have enough BP
>and do not draw the
>first choice). If you
>draw the 2nd choice in
>this bonus pass round, you
>would not be considered for
>the first choice in the
>second pass for the remaining
>80% of the tags.

 

[OutdoorWriter]

LAST EDITED ON Apr-30-09 AT 11:49AM (MST)[p]I think much of the confusion is related to thinking that the draw is done by each individual hunt; it is not. It is done by species via lowest numbers to higher ones in order for each portion of the draw, starting with the 20% pass.

As someone else mentioned, if your #1 hunt choice is already filled, it means it will be gone as your 2nd choice as well if you put in the same choice.

But, as Doug explained, you can draw your 2nd choice on the first pass if you use a DIFFERENT hunt number. If both are filled, your app gets a new # and goes into the 2nd or 3rd draw (depending if you have max bps or not) -- but ONLY IF you selected a 3rd and/or subsequent choices. If someone is in the max pool, however, they would have up to three chances, providing they select more than two hunts and if permits still remain after the 20% pass and the first draw for choices 1 and 2.

Because the draw is by species and not individual hunt choices is one reason why the 50% pass method discussed in the other thread will not result in what the topic starter imagines. The draw is a lot more complicated than the simplistic math used in that discussion.


TONY MANDILE

How To Hunt Coues Deer

 

[Phinkle]

Tony,

As usual your post helps another hunter out. I do appreciate the help from everyone and have adjusted my application as a result. Now lets just hope I (and everyone else) gets drawn.

Thanks again and Happy Hunting!

Phil Hinkle

 

[OutdoorWriter]

LAST EDITED ON Apr-30-09 AT 11:47AM (MST)[p]Glad to help, Phil.

One thing I forgot to add:

Although the draw is conducted by species, the number of permits in the 20% pass is done by hunt number for all species, except for sheep and bison, which come under a different rule.

TONY MANDILE

How To Hunt Coues Deer

 

[redrabbit]

Tony,
Can you inquire with your AZGFD sources if putting the same hunt number for 1st and 2nd choices will get the app rejected? As mentioned above and before, having the same hunt number would prevent one from getting drawn for a 2nd choice hunt in the 20% bonus pass.

Doug

 

[OutdoorWriter]

Doug,

Will do.

BUT...just guessing here, I'd say the app wouldn't be rejected per se. Doing that would be punishment enough because that choice wouldn't come into play.

That said, perhaps during the correction period, G&F MIGHT call to inquire if the applicant really meant to use the same # for both choices.


TONY MANDILE

How To Hunt Coues Deer

 

[OutdoorWriter]

Doug,

Here's the answer:

As I surmised, putting the same hunt # for 1st and 2nd choice will not get an app rejected. It MIGHT -- but not for sure -- trigger a call during the correction period, however.


TONY MANDILE

How To Hunt Coues Deer

 

[redrabbit]

Thanks Tony.

 

[stealth_archer]

thats how I understand it.