Great news

That is a great read. Sucks but-5 to 10 years from now it might be full again as well as Lake Powell and Lake Mead and the spillways could be open. Or-we could have another damn dust bowl just like we have had before. I do believe in climate change as there is plenty of proof it's happened before. I just don't believe what all of the progressive liberals are blaming it on.
 
That is a great read. Sucks but-5 to 10 years from now it might be full again as well as Lake Powell and Lake Mead and the spillways could be open. Or-we could have another damn dust bowl just like we have had before. I do believe in climate change as there is plenty of proof it's happened before. I just don't believe what all of the progressive liberals are blaming it on.
I was just in OKC and it rained 2 of the 7 days I was there. It rained BUCKETS so I only believe in climate change in some parts of the country. They say it happens all the time there....burning sun one minute, dumping rain the next.
 
I was just in OKC and it rained 2 of the 7 days I was there. It rained BUCKETS so I only believe in climate change in some parts of the country. They say it happens all the time there....burning sun one minute, dumping rain the next.
Have lived there 3 times jut a half hour south of OKC. Our 4 ponds dried up and over-flowed into each other more times than I can remember. AGREED!!
 
Last time we lived there (and still wish we did) in 06-07 they called it a hundred-year rain. We literally were catching catfish in bar ditches with worms and any hook thrown on a line.
 
We’ll add another State to our list of “better than Utah, places to live. We’re on a roll today folks. Pay no attention to those chiggers and ticks……..
 
I spent many a month in OKC going to different equipment schools. The weather there is something to be experienced that is for sure. o_O
 
That is a great read. Sucks but-5 to 10 years from now it might be full again as well as Lake Powell and Lake Mead and the spillways could be open. Or-we could have another damn dust bowl just like we have had before. I do believe in climate change as there is plenty of proof it's happened before. I just don't believe what all of the progressive liberals are blaming it on.

There are many conservatives who agree that human activity has accelerated climate change. Where these disagree with liberals is about the solutions, if any, that society should adopt. I do not know very many people these days who disagree over the science--just the politics.
 
There are many conservatives who agree that human activity has accelerated climate change. Where these disagree with liberals is about the solutions, if any, that society should adopt. I do not know very many people these days who disagree over the science--just the politics.
Please add me to the list of conservatives that don’t believe human activity has accelerated climate change. I’ve been feeling lonely lately……

Ha…… like that means anything to anybody……….
 
There are many conservatives who agree that human activity has accelerated climate change. Where these disagree with liberals is about the solutions, if any, that society should adopt. I do not know very many people these days who disagree over the science--just the politics.
there are some simple minded conservatives....no doubt....they gravitate to their kind.....
 
Yes , without doubt the climate is changing! It has rolled through changes over the millenia. To think man has the power , influence to change our planets climate is foolishness. Those who worship themselves promoting this big lie fail to recognize the creator. It's not complicated.
 
Yes , without doubt the climate is changing! It has rolled through changes over the millenia. To think man has the power , influence to change our planets climate is foolishness. Those who worship themselves promoting this big lie fail to recognize the creator. It's not complicated.
It’s all about MONEY.
Ever since the “Go Green” crap started I have been telling people all it is is Green ($$$) into certain peoples pockets.
 
And if anyone thinks that by selling coal to China so they can make solar panels and windmills to sell to us will save the planet from CO2, stop flooding and droughts, prevent forest fires, heat waves, cold spells, lessen hurricanes and tornadoes, save the non-endangered Polar bears, and lower the sea levels, well you need to get a life.
 
Apocalypse Never by Michael Shellenberger should be mandatory reading, the guy is a liberal but also a pragmatist and goes into great detail on what would actually help reduce human created CO2 like helping developing countries with natural gas so they aren't using charcoal and how safe nuclear power is. Its a really good read with a significant amount of detail, cliff notes he doesn't like the eco-colonialism of the majority of the world leftist elite.
 
There are many conservatives who agree that human activity has accelerated climate change. Where these disagree with liberals is about the solutions, if any, that society should adopt. I do not know very many people these days who disagree over the science--just the politics.
Going to have to disagree. The Earth was created for humans and to sustain human life and activity. Yes the climate is changing but it always has changed. Crying out loud they say global warming has been going on for how long? How many times during that timeframe have we had horrendous Winters. I think it was in the sixties they were complaining about global cooling. It's all nonsense. Check the snotel site. There're places right now (as of yesterday anyway) that are 1000 to 6 thousand percent above average snowpack. Things fluctuate all the time, always have always will.
 
Going to have to disagree. The Earth was created for humans and to sustain human life and activity. Yes the climate is changing but it always has changed. Crying out loud they say global warming has been going on for how long? How many times during that timeframe have we had horrendous Winters. I think it was in the sixties they were complaining about global cooling. It's all nonsense. Check the snotel site. There're places right now (as of yesterday anyway) that are 1000 to 6 thousand percent above average snowpack. Things fluctuate all the time, always have always will.

I do not believe the intent was that we would despoil our gift. I agree that climate has always cycled, and that it will change whether we alter our habits or not. But to suggest that we are powerless to alter the earth (Servehim) is belied by numerous bodies of water contaminated, wildlife populations in decline, etc. The earth may have been created to suit us, but that does not mean that we should disrespect it any more than we should turd in our community pool.

The ranks of simple-minded conservatives (Homer's assessment) are growing every day as we gain greater understanding of the science. On the other hand, some states won't even permit the conversation in high school science classes for fear that it may interfere with extraction industries. To each his own, but where I come from it is the refusal to consider both sides of any story that appears simple-minded.
 
I do not believe the intent was that we would despoil our gift. I agree that climate has always cycled, and that it will change whether we alter our habits or not. But to suggest that we are powerless to alter the earth (Servehim) is belied by numerous bodies of water contaminated, wildlife populations in decline, etc. The earth may have been created to suit us, but that does not mean that we should disrespect it any more than we should turd in our community pool.

The ranks of simple-minded conservatives (Homer's assessment) are growing every day as we gain greater understanding of the science. On the other hand, some states won't even permit the conversation in high school science classes for fear that it may interfere with extraction industries. To each his own, but where I come from it is the refusal to consider both sides of any story that appears simple-minded.
Don’t know how long you have been lectured on forth coming environmental threats but this simple-minded conservative, that your talking about, has been lectured by better than you, for approaching 75 years. If you didn’t experience the smog in the 1960’s, the running out of oil lectures in the 1970’s, the nuclear power plant threats of the 1980’s, the Arctic Cap/starving polar bear years, and on and on then you can’t understand our reaction to this bull chit. And if you didn’t, well….. it’s your turn at bat. You think this stuff is all new and fresh…………. Sorry, same games, different day……. Nothing more. Plan accordingly.

If you have lived through it for the last 50-75 years………. You’ve been sorely disappointed in the predictions of the pending environment disaster your entire life, I’d think you’d have figured it out before now.
 
I do not believe the intent was that we would despoil our gift. I agree that climate has always cycled, and that it will change whether we alter our habits or not. But to suggest that we are powerless to alter the earth (Servehim) is belied by numerous bodies of water contaminated, wildlife populations in decline, etc. The earth may have been created to suit us, but that does not mean that we should disrespect it any more than we should turd in our community pool.

The ranks of simple-minded conservatives (Homer's assessment) are growing every day as we gain greater understanding of the science. On the other hand, some states won't even permit the conversation in high school science classes for fear that it may interfere with extraction industries. To each his own, but where I come from it is the refusal to consider both sides of any story that appears simple-minded.
We may have to agree to disagree. I think we should be good stewards of the land. Leave campsites and the backcountry better than we found them. Most people understand that. The problem is the nonsense, the scare tactics, the wasted money on preventing climate change. You really think anything that we are going to do is going to stop climate change? It's always been changing and always will. What do you think we can do to stop climate change? It is nonsense. In 30 years it will be other nonsense. Glacier had to take down all their signs that said the glaciers will be gone in 2020. People get on this climate change kick and it becomes their religion. They throw all common sense, money, and our country down the drain in the name of nonsense. However, some people are making plenty of money on the nonsense.
 
Perfect response griz, bullskin implying I think we should be reckless on caring for this earth ..totally incorrect. God told us ( mankind) we are given dominion ( be respectful and care for ) over His creation. My point is God is in full control and nothing will stop / alter His ultimate plan for His creation. Global warming due to extreme CO2 emissions, I laugh.
 
"People get on this climate change kick and it becomes their religion. They throw all common sense, money, and our country down the drain in the name of nonsense. However, some people are making plenty of money on the nonsense." (schoolhousegriz)

For some, religion is Catholic, others Protestant; some liberal causes, others MAGA. Each is distinguished by a confidence in the information provided by others--to the extent that they see no need to verify independently--or even feel threatened that others wold do so. The greatest strength of science is its ability to accept change when the evidence demands it. It is certainly not a perfect predictive tool, but nothing is--and it is better to adapt in the face of reality than to stand in denial with one's finger in the dike. As for climate change, only time will tell. In the end, I prefer to challenge both sides of any of these arguments, but there is no point in doing so so if one is unwilling to accept the facts wherever they lead.
 
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Apocalypse Never by Michael Shellenberger should be mandatory reading, the guy is a liberal but also a pragmatist and goes into great detail on what would actually help reduce human created CO2 like helping developing countries with natural gas so they aren't using charcoal and how safe nuclear power is. Its a really good read with a significant amount of detail, cliff notes he doesn't like the eco-colonialism of the majority of the world leftist elite.
Michael Shellenberger ran for Governor of California as an Independent and I voted for him, but there was like 30 some candidates on the Ballot. He lost.
 
"People get on this climate change kick and it becomes their religion. They throw all common sense, money, and our country down the drain in the name of nonsense. However, some people are making plenty of money on the nonsense." (schoolhousegriz)

For some, religion is Catholic, others Protestant; some liberal causes, others MAGA. Each is distinguished by a confidence in the information provided by others--to the extent that they see no need to verify independently--or even feel threatened that others wold do so. The greatest strength of science is its ability to accept change when the data demands it. It is certainly not a perfect predictive tool, but nothing is--and it is better to adapt in the face of reality than to stand in denial with one's finger in the dike. As for climate change, only time will tell. In the end, I prefer to challenge both sides of any of these arguments, but there is no point in doing so so if one is unwilling to accept the facts wherever they lead.
I understand the importance of questioning things. However, some people question both sides of a situation because they are not sure which is correct. My bet is that you are not 100% sure which side of the debate you are on because both sides make points that make sense in your mind, which is fine. Since part of you believes humans are the cause of climate change what do you think humans should do to stop it from happening?
 
Michael Shellenberger ran for Governor of California as an Independent and I voted for him, but there was like 30 some candidates on the Ballot. He lost.
That's too bad, he would have been really good for California I bet. We could use more pragmatism in the world.
 
I understand the importance of questioning things. However, some people question both sides of a situation because they are not sure which is correct. My bet is that you are not 100% sure which side of the debate you are on because both sides make points that make sense in your mind, which is fine. Since part of you believes humans are the cause of climate change what do you think humans should do to stop it from happening?

As already stated, I recognize that natural climate change is inevitable and normal--with or without man. The fossil record shows that we are still somewhat below Earth's average temperature over the long term (hundreds of millions of years), so we should not be surprised to see an upward trend. But within this larger pattern appear anomalies that impact life on earth--sometimes catastrophically. The most obvious, measurable cause of change (both long-term and short) appears to be fluctuations in the composition of the atmosphere--in particular, the amounts of carbon dioxide and methane gas.

We see evidence that earth's temperature changes when greenhouse gas "concentrations" rise or fall, as following volcanic eruptions or dramatic expansions of life forms. To discover, therefore, that the climate has changed as a result of the Industrial Revolution is about as surprising as coming home to find that your house is sweltering because someone forgot to turn off the oven. Where, in the past 800,000 years, CO2 never climbed above 300 ppm, it has recently climbed past 420 ppm--an increase of nearly 50% in only 200 years.

Why concerns ourselves, if climate change is normal? Mostly because rapid changes in climate are not normal, and, when they occur, are more disruptive than gradual, natural changes to which ecosystems more easily adapt. And, to the extent possible, because humanity must also adapt, with the result that life for many becomes more difficult and expensive. I am no economist, but those who study the expense of climate change project costs into the many trillions of dollars.

So, to the question of what I would do, I would start by recognizing that our course of action will be very expensive, whether we choose to do something, or choose to do nothing at all. For those willing and able to make the personal financial commitments, just hearing the facts and learning about solutions may drive them to act. For example, many are willing to install solar panels and drive electric cars voluntarily, and clearing the room of misunderstanding when it comes to the science is a good place to start if we hope to encourage them. But I also acknowledge the tragedy of the commons--that many will not act until they see that others are willing to ride the same boat. Why, after all, should I burn less diesel just to see someone else pour it in their truck? This is where government must step in. While less government is usually best, I do believe that government serves an important role in energy production and conservation, just as it does for defense. I would support continued efforts to subsidize clean energy. We subsidize milk and corn, so why not clean air? And we are twice served if government encourages private industry to explore new lithium deposits and battery production technology--it frees us from the stranglehold that China currently hold over our economy. Same with rare earth elements. Investment in American clean energy is a valuable and necessary as investment in traditional energy sources, military, etc. Just as our investment in space paid huge dividends, so will investment in clean energy. The last thing we need is to be the second dog on the chain behind China when it comes to this critical industry.
 
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Humans have been puffing smoke in the air for maybe 250 years. The earth is 4 billion years old. And us "humans" are 200,000 years old.

I find it hard to believe in 250 years we trashed the planet.

But the question know one seems to ask is if intelligent human life has been around for 200,000 years, how did we go from riding horses to flying to the moon......in less than 200 years ?
 
Well!

Dude Narrowed It Down To Evolving From SLIME or Evolving From a MONKEY!



Humans have been puffing smoke in the air for maybe 250 years. The earth is 4 billion years old. And us "humans" are 200,000 years old.

I find it hard to believe in 250 years we trashed the planet.

But the question know one seems to ask is if intelligent human life has been around for 200,000 years, how did we go from riding horses to flying to the moon......in less than 200 years ?
 
As already stated, I recognize that natural climate change is inevitable and normal--with or without man. The fossil record shows that we are still somewhat below Earth's average temperature over the long term (hundreds of millions of years), so we should not be surprised to see an upward trend. But within this larger pattern appear anomalies that impact life on earth--sometimes catastrophically. The most obvious, measurable cause of change (both long-term and short) appears to be fluctuations in the composition of the atmosphere--in particular, the amounts of carbon dioxide and methane gas.

We see evidence that earth's temperature changes when greenhouse gas "concentrations" rise or fall, as following volcanic eruptions or dramatic expansions of life forms. To discover, therefore, that the climate has changed as a result of the Industrial Revolution is about as surprising as coming home to find that you house is sweltering because someone forgot to turn off the oven. Where, in the past 800,000 years, CO2 never climbed about 300 ppm, it has recently climbed past 420 ppm--an increase of nearly 50% in only 200 years.

Why concerns ourselves, if climate change is normal? Mostly because rapid changes in climate are more disruptive than the normally slow, natural changes to which ecosystems may gradually adapt. And, to the extent possible, because humanity must also adapt, with the result that life for many becomes more difficult and expensive. I am no economist, but those who study the expense of climate change project costs into the many trillions of dollars.

So, to the question of what I would do, I would start by recognizing that our course of action will be very expensive, whether we choose to do something, or choose to do nothing at all. For those willing and able to make the personal financial commitments, just hearing the facts and learning about solutions may drive them to act. For example, many are willing to install solar panels and drive electric cars voluntarily, and clearing the room of misunderstanding when it comes to the science is a good place to start if we hope to encourage them. But I also acknowledge the tragedy of the commons--that many will not act until they see that others are willing to ride the same boat. Why, after all, should I burn less diesel just so see someone else pour it in their truck? This is where government must step in. While less government is a good rule to go by, I do believe that government serves an important role in energy production and conservation, just as it does for defense. I would support continued efforts to subsidize clean energy. We subsidize milk and corn, so why not clean air? And we are twice served if government encourages private industry to explore new lithium deposits and battery production technology--it frees us from the stranglehold that China currently hold over our economy. Same with rare earth elements. Investment in American clean energy is a valuable and necessary as investment in traditional energy sources, military, etc. Just as our investment in space paid huge dividends, so will investment in clean energy. The last thing we need is to be the second dog on the chain behind China when it comes to this massive industry.
Thanks for the response. It seems like you have thought about it quite a bit. I will say, you might want to rethink having government step in and tell us what when and where we can drive. Goodness that is a scary thought! If that happens we will be in a sad state, who knows what else they would control at that point. Hey you can't go on vacation, can't hunt out of state, cant go visit your kids. Horrible idea IMO! ?That is where you and I will never agree. Thanks for your time. Good luck in the hunts, be thankful you are allowed to take trucks, 4 wheelers etc.

By the way, do you drive an electric car (do you know how electricity is created? By burning fossil fuels) Do you eat beef. Do you ever fly on a plane, do you have a 4 wheeler or side by side? My bet is you do most of those things. You see all these climate change enthusiasts preach about change, but they dont sacrifice anything, they just want YOU to sacrifice. They are hypocrites. Not saying you are a hypocrite. I don't know you or your way of life. So what sacrifices have you made in the name of climate change? You have to back up your words with actions. Otherwise it's all just talk and hypocrisy like these other liberal elitists.
 
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Thanks for the response. It seems like you have thought about it quite a bit. I will say, you might want to rethink having government step in and tell us what when and where we can drive. Goodness that is a scary thought! If that happens we will be in a sad state, who knows what else they would control at that point. Hey you can't go on vacation, can't hunt out of state, cant go visit your kids. Horrible idea IMO! ?That is where you and I will never agree. Thanks for your time. Good luck in the hunts, be thankful you are allowed to take trucks, 4 wheelers etc.

By the way, do you drive an electric car (do you know how electricity is created? By burning fossil fuels) Do you eat beef. Do you ever fly on a plane, do you have a 4 wheeler or side by side? My bet is you do most of those things. You see all these climate change enthusiasts preach about change, but they dont sacrifice anything, they just want YOU to sacrifice. They are hypocrites. Not saying you are a hypocrite. I don't know you or your way of life. So what sacrifices have you made in the name of climate change? You have to back up your words with actions. Otherwise it's all just talk and hypocrisy like these other liberal elitists.

I subscribe to the idea that WE are government. We have the ability to restrict behavior, or not, as the majority sees fit. I do not hear anyone calling for government telling us where and when we can drive. That is a non-starter.

I do not own an electric car, and I do plenty of things that we both recognize as harmful. On the other had, I do understand that there are many sources of energy (some better than others) from which electricity may be generated, and have taken steps to reduce my impact to the extent that I find comfortable. I am one of those who believes the problem is real and am content to make some effort to resolve it. Those at either extreme of the debate would scoff at my efforts for opposite reasons.

You may think me liberal simply because I believe science has exposed age-old errors in thinking and threatens to upend other closely held beliefs. You may think me an elitist because I had enough money to purchase a solar electric system for my house. On the other hand, I do not own a quad, a boat, a trailer and any other number of toys because I have had to make choices, like anyone else. Is the man who commits his resources to clean energy somehow an elitist where the man who commits his to ATVs somehow not? I don't see it that way.

The truth is, I could do better. We all could. But, as I have already said, it is pointless to walk that plank alone. There are, undoubtedly, many who will lecture others on how they should live with no intention of following their own advice. We see it with property, sobriety, marriage, religion, etc. And that is exactly where government can be helpful. When society agrees on a set of rules, every citizen is bound to abide them. There should be no one who preaches without sharing the sacrifice.
 
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Sounds like you have made some sacrifices. I have nothing but respect for you. Even though we disagree, you are walking the walk, not just talking the talk. If you ever what to change your mind and see things differently you can join my team?. We need thoughtful folks. Plus then you can go get a 4 wheeler or something!? Have a goodnight!
 
Hee Haw…… Gore was so flattered by that question……….. then Branson sucked all the air right back out of his lungs. ???
 

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