Help with NM antelope hunt
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upmuley
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Get with Jim Welles www.newmexicobiggamehunting.com He will point you in the right direction.
The nonres public rifle antelope system in NMex is a total joke! You have to apply for a group of units and if you draw are assigned a ranch. There is no way of scouting out a unit ahead of time and applying for that particular unit or knocking on doors and obtaining permission to hunt once you draw a tag. The ranch you are assigned is what you are stuck with.
Landowners are given a portion of the total tags available each year that they can sell or give away. Most of the premium tags sell for $1,500+ and many of the premium guided hunts go for $2,000 to $4,000. If you are a landowner, outfitter, or wealthy hunter this is a fantastic system because you or your clients can get tags and hunt every year. If you are a public hunter that can't afford a guided hunt or prefer to do it all on your own you are out of luck!
My son drew a NMex antelope tag in 2005 and was assigned a ranch. The rancher's pay clients were driven around to the best locations on the ranch while we were dropped off and required to hike for several hours at a time. We were dropped off in a corner of the ranch with few antelope and didn't see any decent bucks. The rancher wouldn't even allow us to drive our truck on the roads on his ranch! By the time I caught on to what was going on it was to late and most of the better bucks were shot! I can't say this will happen on every ranch but I was pretty furious! At the end of the day the rancher wouldn't even look me in the face because I think he could see the steam coming out my nose and ears! It was my son's first experience hunting NMex antelope and was certainly frustrating!
I really think the NMex rifle antelope system needs to be changed and I am totally amazed that NMex residents haven't done something about it! On the surface it may sound great that the public has "equal and total" access to private ranches but I would much rather hunt a different state and do my own research, scouting, and hunting!
Landowners are given a portion of the total tags available each year that they can sell or give away. Most of the premium tags sell for $1,500+ and many of the premium guided hunts go for $2,000 to $4,000. If you are a landowner, outfitter, or wealthy hunter this is a fantastic system because you or your clients can get tags and hunt every year. If you are a public hunter that can't afford a guided hunt or prefer to do it all on your own you are out of luck!
My son drew a NMex antelope tag in 2005 and was assigned a ranch. The rancher's pay clients were driven around to the best locations on the ranch while we were dropped off and required to hike for several hours at a time. We were dropped off in a corner of the ranch with few antelope and didn't see any decent bucks. The rancher wouldn't even allow us to drive our truck on the roads on his ranch! By the time I caught on to what was going on it was to late and most of the better bucks were shot! I can't say this will happen on every ranch but I was pretty furious! At the end of the day the rancher wouldn't even look me in the face because I think he could see the steam coming out my nose and ears! It was my son's first experience hunting NMex antelope and was certainly frustrating!
I really think the NMex rifle antelope system needs to be changed and I am totally amazed that NMex residents haven't done something about it! On the surface it may sound great that the public has "equal and total" access to private ranches but I would much rather hunt a different state and do my own research, scouting, and hunting!
LAST EDITED ON Jan-10-06 AT 05:54PM (MST)[p]Its sad that this happened to jims. Had he known that the rancher MUST allow EQUAL and unrestricted access as his paying clients to the draw hunters, he'd have been in a better position to explain to the rancher that he will be calling a game warden to clarify the rules. Please call the Divison of Wildlife at 505-476-8000 and ask to speak to RJ Kirkpatrick or his Asst Chief with regard to the rules. The Law Enforcement Chief contact at the same number is Dan Brooks. Please ask him to clarify how the draw works and your rights as a public hunter. I have seen public hunters come to NM and kill some monsters and not run into the BS that happened to jims. If his case is the norm, then the ranchers in NM will continue to get a black eye. I have personally talked to Farm Bureau and Cattlegrowers about this crap and they are honestly making sure their memberships are aware of the stain they get when they don't abide by the law.
I actually contacted the game warden and landowner by phone prior to the hunt to find out more details and rules for the particular ranch my son drew. The game warden told me that I should have equal and unrestricted access to the ranch. When my son and I arrived we were told by the rancher that we would be dropped off the following morning and would only be allowed to hike to hunt. I told the rancher that I had no problem hiking to hunt if all the other hunters were doing the same. He said that is how the other hunters would be hunting so I didn't think it was any big deal. We weren't allowed to access the ranch with my truck.
The next morning we were dropped off in an area with few to 0 antelope and it soon became obvious that the guided hunters were being driven around in trucks to the best spots and had the best opportunity for getting the best bucks on the ranch. They were abiding by the law (keeping their vehicles on established roads) but it was obvious my son got screwed on this hunt! I really didn't want to contact the game warden or start any trouble so we continued hunting on foot for most of the day.
All the guided hunters were finished hunting by noon while we were still hiking and trying to locate antelope. I was extremely flustered and really didn't want to call the game warden or start anything with the rancher so when we found a small buck my son shot it and we left. My son and I both have sour tastes in our mouthes from his first antelope hunt experience in New Mexico and I've heard this kind of thing is fairly common with the public hunters.
If any of you have had similar experiences with public draw New Mexico antelope tags I would urge you to contact the NMG&F. I'm sure not all ranches are like the one we hunted but according to the game warden we were hunting one of the better ranches in the area my son drew the tag.
I would also urge you to voice your opinions on the present New Mexico rifle antelope system especially if they conduct hunter surveys! As I stated in the other post I am totally amazed the New Mexico residents haven't complained about the current rifle antelope system! If you are looking for a great public draw antelope hunting experience I would definitely recommend hunting some other Western state! I have never ran into these problems in other states! If you are wealthy and can afford a guided hunt you will likely have a great experience in New Mexico but if you are an average Joe like me and my son the public hunts are a joke!
The next morning we were dropped off in an area with few to 0 antelope and it soon became obvious that the guided hunters were being driven around in trucks to the best spots and had the best opportunity for getting the best bucks on the ranch. They were abiding by the law (keeping their vehicles on established roads) but it was obvious my son got screwed on this hunt! I really didn't want to contact the game warden or start any trouble so we continued hunting on foot for most of the day.
All the guided hunters were finished hunting by noon while we were still hiking and trying to locate antelope. I was extremely flustered and really didn't want to call the game warden or start anything with the rancher so when we found a small buck my son shot it and we left. My son and I both have sour tastes in our mouthes from his first antelope hunt experience in New Mexico and I've heard this kind of thing is fairly common with the public hunters.
If any of you have had similar experiences with public draw New Mexico antelope tags I would urge you to contact the NMG&F. I'm sure not all ranches are like the one we hunted but according to the game warden we were hunting one of the better ranches in the area my son drew the tag.
I would also urge you to voice your opinions on the present New Mexico rifle antelope system especially if they conduct hunter surveys! As I stated in the other post I am totally amazed the New Mexico residents haven't complained about the current rifle antelope system! If you are looking for a great public draw antelope hunting experience I would definitely recommend hunting some other Western state! I have never ran into these problems in other states! If you are wealthy and can afford a guided hunt you will likely have a great experience in New Mexico but if you are an average Joe like me and my son the public hunts are a joke!
Phantom Hunter
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Just wondering how often ranch owner/managers try to pull stunts like happened to Jims? I have been applying for a tag for several years now. Hopefully this will be my year. Would hate to have to deal with a situation like Jims had. Anyone else have bad experiences?
Phantom Hunter
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NMHUNTNUTT1
Guest
That is pretty bad , I for your son as he wasn't given equal oppertunity as the paying hunters , but I have hunted on a few different ranchs and have had the opposit dealings . The ranchers actaully pointed us in the right direction . I know the Martinez Ranch up near Springer was doing this and the hunters called the G& F and they showed up and set rules straight .
I don't like the rifle system here though , you used to be able to indicate a unit preferance , but that changed last year , now you have no clue what unit/area you'll be assigned to .....NMHUNTNUTT
I don't like the rifle system here though , you used to be able to indicate a unit preferance , but that changed last year , now you have no clue what unit/area you'll be assigned to .....NMHUNTNUTT
I have always asked myself why the New Mexico antelope rifle draw system is so much different than the system fo elk, deer, and every other species offered? In fact, this is the only system in the entire US that has a public draw system like this?
There is an incredible amount of public land in New Mexico and right now rifle antelope hunters don't have access to any of it in the public draw? Public draw hunters also don't have the opportunity to do any research and scouting before applying for tags because they have no way of knowing where they will be hunting? This system is a joke as far as I'm concerned!
If you are an outfitter or rancher it's a fantastic system. They can get tags for their clients every year and charge premium prices. It is the average Joe that applies for public tags that gets screwed with this system! Yes, the public that draw tags have access to otherwise private land but if you ask me I would much rather draw an antelope tag in a state like Wyoming where I can research a unit and go to work figuring out where to hunt! I have no problem in Wyoming finding private ranches to hunt and many of them allow me to hunt for free or for dirt cheap trespass fees. I always have the option of hunting public land within the unit I draw...unlike New Mexico! It is also an advantage to have the opportunity to scout areas with big bucks and hunt them rather than being assigned a ranch that may or may not have any trophy quality bucks!
There is an incredible amount of public land in New Mexico and right now rifle antelope hunters don't have access to any of it in the public draw? Public draw hunters also don't have the opportunity to do any research and scouting before applying for tags because they have no way of knowing where they will be hunting? This system is a joke as far as I'm concerned!
If you are an outfitter or rancher it's a fantastic system. They can get tags for their clients every year and charge premium prices. It is the average Joe that applies for public tags that gets screwed with this system! Yes, the public that draw tags have access to otherwise private land but if you ask me I would much rather draw an antelope tag in a state like Wyoming where I can research a unit and go to work figuring out where to hunt! I have no problem in Wyoming finding private ranches to hunt and many of them allow me to hunt for free or for dirt cheap trespass fees. I always have the option of hunting public land within the unit I draw...unlike New Mexico! It is also an advantage to have the opportunity to scout areas with big bucks and hunt them rather than being assigned a ranch that may or may not have any trophy quality bucks!
mickeyelk
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Thanks for the info. I've been applying in New Mexico since 1999 and still haven't drawn a tag. If I do I'll be sure I ask questions before I go and get phone numbers to take along, just in case. Hopefully I won't experience anything like that, but again, thanks for the info and the heads up!
G
gilamonster55
Guest
In 2004 my brother & I drew two public tags for NM Unit 16. We were both assigned different, neighboring ranches near Silver City.
I had no problem at all with the ranch I was assigned. I was given access to scout the ranch, and given 'tips' on where on the ranch I could find good bucks, quantity, etc. The night before the hunt I was asked what area I wanted to hunt(basically given first choice), the rancher would take clients to other areas of the ranch. I believe that a big part of the ranchers attitude was that fact that it was a good sized ranch, and he probably figured that there was a lot of opportunities for all of us.......clients or public hunters. Although I was a public hunter I got to say I was probably treated as a DIY client.
Being that I was successful in that rifle hunt, I applied for Unit 16 with a bow in 2005(didn't draw). But I believe the way the public antelope bow hunt is structured is the way ALL public antelope hunts in NM should be. NM Antelope archery hunts are structured the same as deer, elk, etc.
Antleope public bow hunts - you apply for the Unit of your choice, if you draw you can hunt ANY public land in the unit or private land in that unit with written permission.
I had no problem at all with the ranch I was assigned. I was given access to scout the ranch, and given 'tips' on where on the ranch I could find good bucks, quantity, etc. The night before the hunt I was asked what area I wanted to hunt(basically given first choice), the rancher would take clients to other areas of the ranch. I believe that a big part of the ranchers attitude was that fact that it was a good sized ranch, and he probably figured that there was a lot of opportunities for all of us.......clients or public hunters. Although I was a public hunter I got to say I was probably treated as a DIY client.
Being that I was successful in that rifle hunt, I applied for Unit 16 with a bow in 2005(didn't draw). But I believe the way the public antelope bow hunt is structured is the way ALL public antelope hunts in NM should be. NM Antelope archery hunts are structured the same as deer, elk, etc.
Antleope public bow hunts - you apply for the Unit of your choice, if you draw you can hunt ANY public land in the unit or private land in that unit with written permission.
