idaho archery antelope change

[orion23]

What do you guys think of the new change to ID archery antelope going to unlimited draw? I think that it is needed but i hate the thought that when i apply for once in a lifetime i can no longer hunt antelope. That said, its a sacrafice that im ok with to fix our problems here in idaho.

There are a lot of other changes as well. im glad to see F&G making big changes to help our herds.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[3bigelkid]

Travis,
Was this adopted by the Commisioners for sure? Is there a link to the other changes? Or do you have an inside source since they just met today?
Thanks
Jake

 

[orion23]

This is the article....

News Release

Idaho Department of Fish and Game

600 South Walnut

P.O. Box 25

Boise, ID 83707-0025 http://fishandgame.idaho.gov



?To Preserve, Protect, Perpetuate and Manage?



Contact: Niels Nokkentved 208-334-3746

For Immediate Release



F&G Commission Adopts Wolf Seasons

Idaho Fish and Game Commission Tuesday, March 24, adopted big game seasons as recommended by Fish and Game biologists, with a few last minute changes in response to public comments.

Commissioners adopted hunting season dates on wolves statewide, pending removal of wolves in Idaho from the endangered species list, expected to take effect later this spring. The seasons would be the same as proposed last year, except seasons would be extended in the Lolo and Sawtooth zones to run from September 1 through March 31.

The seasons would run from September 15 through December 31 in the Selway and Middle Fork zones, and elsewhere from October 1 through December 31.

Commissioners would set harvest quotas in August. Meanwhile, Fish and Game will respond aggressively to chronic depredation.

Other seasons changes include capping elk tags in two elk zones; reduced general deer opportunities for white-tail deer in northern Idaho and mule deer in southern Idaho; changing general pronghorn archery season to unlimited controlled hunts; and increased opportunities for senior and disabled hunters.

State big game populations, like the nation?s economy, are going through a period of correction, some planned some not, former big game manager Brad Compton told commissioners Tuesday.

Under the seasons adopted by the commission, A and B tags in the Sawtooth Elk Management Zone and A tags in the Diamond Creek Zone will be capped. A and B tags already are capped in the Selway and Middle Fork zones, and B tags already are capped in the Dworshak, Lolo and Elk City zones.

The new caps will be phased in over three years. In the first year, A tags will be reduced by 15 percent in the Diamond Creek Zone; A tags will be reduced by 37 percent and B tags will be reduced by 27 percent in the Sawtooth Zone.

Other season changes are:

? Deer, controlled hunts:

o 8 percent reduction in antlered hunts.

o 4 percent reduction in antlerless hunts.

? Deer, general seasons:

o 26 day reduction in northern Idaho seasons.

o 7 day reduction in southern Idaho seasons.

? Elk, controlled hunts:

o 2 percent increase in antlered hunts.

o 7 percent reduction in antlerless hunts.

? Elk, general season hunts:

o 27 day reduction in antlerless hunts.

o 45 day reduction in antlered hunts.

? Black bear season extended in the Clearwater Region units 14, 15 and 18.



IDFG

03-24-09



Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[andrew_12gauge]

you can still apply for unlimited controlled hunts even if you apply for OIL tags

 

[orion23]

LAST EDITED ON Mar-24-09 AT 08:55PM (MST)[p]Really?? I hope your right. ill have to look into that.

Just looked into it and im so happy to say i was wrong.... NICE!

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[tworivers]

I think it is another way to get 6.50 cents or more in fees.. Hunter congestion... Not a problem in the Units I hunt I have never seen another archery guy over here in eastern Idaho, Actually in field carrying a bow. If it is unit specific then deal with it as a unit by unit problem. Kinda like Unit 39 archery deer hunt. Not a fan of proposed antelope changes.



Get your hunt on!!
tixs,lodging,for you
cruises,trips for her!
songdogtravel.com

 

[madmoose]

+1 two rivers. whats going to stop them from going unlimited on any other general animal? what judges the line?

clearly creative results to generate revenue from slipping tag sales from poor management...

someones gotta pay for it..... it sure isnt going to come out of there paycheck.

 

[htnfool]

Travis,

You can still apply for a rifle antelope tag and then 2nd choice for the archery tag, if it is unlimited. You probably knew that already, you wise old one.

I can't see how unlimited tags will help the situation. It still allows everybody a tag. The best we could hope for is it forces you to pick a unit. That wouldn't help much. We hunt the same waterholes every year anyway. I have a hard time believing that the IDFG will make it unlimited tags. There has to be more to it. Shorter season? Bucks only? 6" or better ( that's what she said!) If any one of the above stipulations is required it can only help. Archers are just to damn good these days and the antelope are suffering. I am sure the IDFG has something concocted.

Scott

 

[orion23]

fool- yeah i did know that, but i didnt know you could when you apply for a once in a lifetime, but you can. Plan on trying goat this year.

Im not sure how this will reduce pressure on waterholes like they were trying to solve, but i do like that they are making some BIG changes to try to turn this state around. Its about time.

Not everything is probably perfect but at least they are changing things, its a start.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[htnfool]

I agree, gotta start somewhere.

 

[muleybucks]

Travis,

There was also an idea thrown out at the F&G meeting the other night which was to use "portable blinds" only. This was intended to help reduce the conflict of waterholes having plywood blinds set on them all season long.

The positive of the unlimited draw, in my eyes, is it may reduce the "hey--let's go antelope hunting this weekend--my brother has a bow you can use" scenario. I know this is limited and most archery hunters in my area are pretty serious. That said, everyone has to start somewhere and I know there is some of this going on. The other thing it will reduce is hunters who get into the goats from recruiting other buddies (wives/relatives,etc.) to buy tags after the season has arrived and they themselves have filled their own tag. I think this will make the serious hunters pleased that they can continue (for now) to hunt every year and will deter the last minute decision makers or those "not so serious".

Truth be told, I'm for some restriction if it creates a better experience in the field for hunters.

 

[Frontier]

> I think it is another
>way to get 6.50 cents
>or more in fees..

I agree with tworivers, another way to get $6.50 without having to go to the legislature.

 

[orion23]

Your last statement says it all for me!

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[andrew_12gauge]

another thing i saw in the proposals was limiting tags to 1200 statewide why dont they just do that? Seems like it would be a good plan first come first served just like non res deer and elk tags once they are gone they are gone

 

[orion23]

I saw that and that is the one that made most sense to me. i voted for that one. Maybe it was the application fee like stated above, but 'unlimited' draw is just that. i know they wanted to cut the number of tags to help the herds and im not sure this was the best way to do it.

i sure would have liked to see first come, first served with a quota myself.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[7mmgilbert]

I agree with 2rivers, no good reason for the change.

 

[Salmonfg]

Results of the on-line survey were that unlimited controlled hunts were favored over the other options, but not by a large margin. So the department's recommendation and Commission decision followed what the majority of hunters requested. I thought the state-wide tag cap would be more palatable (that's why I originally put it forward as an option). Looks like I was wrong.

There were a couple reasons for doing something in the first place. One was complaints of hunter congestion/hunt quality issues. Another is the fact that pronghorn archery hunter numbers increased by 120% over the last 8 years and harvest increased around 56%. The additional havest was causing some managers, including myself, to propose further reductions in controlled any weapon permits. Last year the Commission suggested that IDFG should consider more equal treatment of user groups rather than primarily directing opportunity losses at rifle hunters.

By the way, it appears some of "it" is going to come out of state employee paychecks:

"Idaho Legislature Votes for 3 Percent Salary Reduction
Joint Finance-Appropriations Committee makes decision on how to handle 5 percent reduction in personnel costs, amid debate on its necessity

By Sharon Fisher,

In an attempt to help reduce potential layoffs, Idaho?s Joint Finance-Appropriations Committee (JFAC) voted today to implement a 5 percent reduction in personnel costs through a 3 percent across-the-board salary reduction, followed by existing salary savings, keeping positions vacant, furloughs, and then, if necessary, laying people off..."


Tom Keegan
IDFG Salmon Region Wildlife Manager

 

[orion23]

salmonfg,

Do they have predections or estimates on how many less tags this will amount to? Being 'unlimimited' doesnt seem like it will help much with overcrowding. i know it will a little, but will it enough?

i guess it was mentioned above that e. idaho isnt very crowded, but i know central and western ID are very crowded.

Ill be interested to see how many less tags are issued this year.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[Salmonfg]

Travis,

No, no estimate on tag sales under the unlimited controlled scenario. I suspect a drop, at least during the first year, because some will not be aware they need to apply by 5 Jun. Regardless it may be difficult to judge the impact on tag sales because sales had been increasing so quickly over the last several years (from ~820 in 2001, 1,200 in 2005, ~1,820 in 2007 and 08). 2008 sales equalled 2007, perhaps because fuel costs were at a high point and other economic issues influenced participation. If so, economics may play a larger role than regulations again this year. Or maybe we just happened to reach the number of people interested in archery pronghorn.

As noted, the congestion/hunt quality issue has been greatest in southwestern Idaho and that is why those hunts were split out into smaller hunt areas (potentially reduces crowding because hunters cannot move around to adjacent areas). Interim proposals included limits on hunter numbers in those areas, but apparently the final decision was to start with unlimited permits.

"Will it be enough?" That will be up to hunters to determine. If complaints continue, I would anticipate managers would again ask hunters what further steps they would like to see taken to reduce their problem. From a hunting opportunity standpoint, we'll monitor harvest and population information. If objectives are not being met, further restriction may be necessary.

Tom Keegan
IDFG Salmon Region Wildlife Manager

 

[orion23]

Thanks for the info. ill be curious to see what its like out there this year also.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[Huntnfever]

So how does this affect me? I already bought my tag cause its one the more expensive tags and i got it and my archery permit out the way first? I am sure others have already bought a tag..

has anyone seen my kittie

 

[htnfool]

It won't affect you. You will just apply for the permit through the draw process. Should be a guaranteed draw. The IDFG will reissue you a new controlled hunt tag and destroy the old tag. No big deal.

 

[trlrtrsh]

So if I go and buy the OTC tag and then submit a unlimited draw, it will guarantee me a tag?

 

[muleybucks]

Tom (Salmonfg),

Do you have any insight as to the result of the "portable blinds only" comment suggested to the commissioners at the Boise forum? This comment seemed to make pretty good sense to me. The comment was that the plywood blinds which are constructed on waterholes as a stake of ownership should not be allowed. This actually made some sense to me as a way to reduce conflict with a small rule change. I also agree that the unlimited is a logical first step, but I am not sure if that, by itself, will reduce conflict (in SW Idaho).

Thanks for the info.


[email protected]

 

[htnfool]

>So if I go and buy
>the OTC tag and then
>submit a unlimited draw, it
>will guarantee me a tag?
>



There should not be OTC tags for antelope this year, if the IDFG goes to an unlimited draw for archery. I don't think you can buy a tag/receipt right now, maybe you can? It won't be worth the paper it's written on though. I take that back, IDFG would probably but it back, or more than likely they will exchange it for the controlled tag, but you will 'have to' apply. The way it looks. If you apply for the unlimited archery tag, then you will get a tag for, I'm guessing here, that unit or perhaps statewide. The regs should be coming out real soon, we'll see.

 

[Salmonfg]

Muleybucks,

The portable blinds comment was news to me when I read it in this forum. My first reaction is how would one define "portable blind only" in such a way that it would substantially differ from current practices? For example, couldn't I take my "portable pop-up" blind out to the same place where I "built" a blind last year, stake it down, brush it up, etc 10 days before season and leave it there until 7 days after season (i.e., the current regulations for blind placement on BLM land)? It's not the blind itself that is the problem, but rather the time frame when they are in place. It sounds like what some people may be trying to get at is more like the regulations sometimes applied to intensively hunted waterfowl areas (e.g., hours for decoy placement, etc.)...

Tom Keegan
IDFG Salmon Region Wildlife Manager

 

[orion23]

id like to have to see the blinds come down every day and put back up. even if the law does state that a blind does not stake claim to a waterhole, most respectful hunters will give that person first right of refusal.

I have been out found a blind without anyone in it, set up my own blind next to theirs. Then they come out at noon. i left but who should get to hunt it. the guy that came out in the middle of the night to set up his blind or me who was physically there first.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[muleybucks]

Travis,

I have to agree with you 100% and believe that the intention of the "portable" blind only proposal would be such that a hunter who has a "pop-up" (portable) blind set on a spot would/should have the first right of refusal at daylight, assuming they had been hunting there the prior day. The experience you had is exactly the one I suspect most would hope to avoid. I think the BLM/F&G regulation should allow for "flagging/dummy blinds" which could be as large as say, 6x6 feet but that they be a 3 sided triangle with no roof and this should simply be used as flagging or a decoy blind. Then, when a person (you, me or whomever) goes to hunt this location, just like duck hunting (except duck blinds stay in place all season), we pop up a portable blind and hunt. There is no "blind" in place that anyone can show up at noon and claim ownership to and run me off. This regulation would more accurately support the "first come, first served" idea which parallels the logic for waterfowl blinds on public land.

I have to think this would promote "back up plans" for most hunters and, in the area I hunt, it would keep 2 or 3 guys from putting up 5 blinds and hunting only the weekends. They claim they have "buddies coming" to hunt the other spots but the only time they seem to show up is when someone goes past their camp to hunt these spots. Then, miraculously, one of the guys shows up to hunt. If the portable regulation were in place, and assuming 2 guys wouldn't buy 5 double bull blinds to stake their ownership to more spots than they can hunt at any given time, it would generate less conflict and once an animal was havested (tag punched), the portable blind wouldn't sit on the water hole till the end of the season, continuing to occupy space and continue to insinuate ownership of the location. My perspective here is that I have about 5 spots that I love to hunt every year. Some get hammered opening weekend and then no pressure after labor day. Others get sporadic pressure all season, but there is NO WAY to get a plywood blind (other than helicopter) to these spots. The times I run into other hunters who have hiked into these spots, many times we exchange phone numbers and then coordinate future trips to avoid the conflict. The exchange of words typically goes much differently when someone who has a plywood blind set up on a waterhole shows up just after daylight and you are sitting there with the pop-up blind (not inside their plywood blind).

Tom--it is very likely that your area is not one of the ones with major hunter conflict, whereas the country Travis and I hunt, likely has the largest concentration of hunters in the state, so we might be talking about apples and oranges here.

It is my belief that the unlimited draw will do nothing to noticeably reduce hunter presure and conflict in SW Idaho and in order to resolve this, further steps will need to be taken in the future. I have to say that I belive the "portable blind" restriction in SW Idaho would make a notable difference, not so much in hunting pressure, but reducing the conflict and changing the perception of ownership of selected spots.

That's my .02 anyway.

[email protected]

 

[orion23]

Have to agee...

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer

 

[gemstatejake]

Hooray! More loss of opportunity for Idaho hunters!Also more complex regs to boot!






Most from this board should be ecstatic...........

"reduced general deer opportunities for whitetails in northern Idaho"

This one here should earn whoever proposed it a promotion. After all, you defineatly dont want general Idaho hunters pursuing perhaps the most abundant/resiliant big game population in the state.

 

[Idahoron]

think the archery antelope hunt should have went with Draw only and only give out 30 tags TOPS in unit 46. The archery hunters are killing WAY more pronghorns than the rifle hunters are. The number of animals is dropping overall and the size of the bucks is getting smaller. How long with this have to go on before something is done? The unlimited draw is not going to do anything to address the problem. Ron

 

[Huntnfever]

I already have the tag, according to fish and game in idaho falls they have no clue anything has changed big suprise there, guess i will call boise...They also stated that you cant have a antelope tag cause they arent for sale. I wonder if anyone ever actually tried it at the office? Because you can buy the tag... Also in my experience, Fish and game doesnt refund money.

has anyone seen my kittie

 

[orion23]

if you bought it before the change, which you did, you should be grandfathered in.....so to speak. IMO.

Travis
www.RidgelineOutdoors.com
Blacks-Creek Packs Dealer