Is it the Culture? Or what?

hossblur

hossblur

Long Time Member
Messages
10,589
I read theses posts, I read about $fw, BGF, THE DON, etc, etc. In a lot of these posts the general theme seems to come down to whether or not you put your trust in some group/person that claims salvation, yet we never challenge or check for results.
This seems to be a Utah issue. The attitude of Texas seems to be "f you", the states around us seem to be very independent in thought and actions. So, AND I AM NOT BASHING, my question is why is Utah so easily duped? Is it the Mormon influence? And AGAIN, I am pro a lot of mormon culture(self sufficiency, family, etc) but there does seem to be a HUGE blind spot for this kind of activity. Not just in wildlife, but with scams of all sort, Utah seems to be screwed over and over.

I ask, because I think in order to ACTUALLY accomplish what we want; more deer, less wolves, more access, etc, it seems that we have to overcome this blind faith tendency, and actually DEMAND RESULTS or find someone/something/ else to accomplish what we want. Being able to do so I believe means knowing WHY we fall in line so easily, and figuring out ways to stop this.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Or maybe its you that isn't seeing the results: and its you with the problem. Some of us are seeing the results of what going on, but there are some like you that cant get the chip off of your shoulder and see the results.
 
Follow along with the flock, do what you're told, and don't ask questions. Just like what Cantkillanything does.
 
LAST EDITED ON Apr-30-15 AT 01:57PM (MST)[p]I guess you boys will "see" whatever you want to see.
If you want to drag this into a protracted religious discussion, then I suppose you will.... but to what end? To prove how much smarter you are than whom?
Zeke
 
LAST EDITED ON May-01-15 AT 07:06AM (MST)[p]Why is Utah the fraud capital of America? Why are so many pyramid schemes er I mean Multi level Marketing companies based in Utah?
 
Zeke,

No, lets not drag this into a protracted religious discussion. But lets be honest, there is a Mormon, or Utah culture, and it is very different in attitudes and action than most if not all the other states in the country. I was born and raised here, my family was the first that Brigham sent into the Sanpete valley, so I am rooted in Mormon Culture, and in whole its a good thing to be part of. Now, then you tell me how $fw has not been estasblished in the states surrounding us(yeah I know there is some presence but they don't run any other state). There is no BGF, even in states that actually have wolves(I know you have closed your eyes and haven't seen any wolves in Utah either).
To pretend that Utahns, Utah culture, Mormon Culture doesn't have blind spots to this kind of top down, authoritarian, blind faith leaning would mean that you totally pay no attention to statistics on financial fraud that occurs here, or the cults that wrap themselves in some bastadized version of LDS(Jeffs, LaBarons, etc) NOTICE I DON'T BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THAT THEY ARE SOME PART OF MORMONISM, KEEP YOUR ANGER IN CHECK, DON'T READ ANYTHING INTO THAT, other than these groups do exist in Utah, in pretty good numbers.

The saddest part, IMO, is that there are obviously thousands of good dudes, that believe in doing good work, and really care about issues. They joined up with $fw becasue they were the group that talked a good game. These guys, don't know if your one or not, should be commended. HOWEVER, they watch, they see, and yet they turn a blind eye to what their leadership does. And that sucks, because they take the slings and arrows, the $fw hierarchy stays underground, and lets them. Watch the wolf report on channel 13. It went the way we all knew it would when it came to talking to Ryan. Like $fw, BGF if you don't have something to hide, you don't hide.



The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>It has nothing to do with
>the church and everything to
>do with your educational system.
>

You might be right. Funny thing is, and I don't know where your from, but guys see mormon, and glaze over thinking its an attack, which this isn't, in fact I would prefer not talk religion, more of a culture thing. BUT, guys will jump up and down about how its not different YET you wrote one sentence, that sentence shows what I think is interesting, you said "the church". In Utah "the church" is used all the time, in fact I use it, but it does show the culural attitude. My guess is if your Catholic or Jewish, "the church" seems odd?

Even as there has been a TON of issuses with $fw, how they operate, the money involved, etc, WE GAVE MONEY TO BGF, who are exactly the same, follow the same path, and give zero results. I can't help but wonder when the next "savior" will come, follow that same path, and suck up more of my money and do nothing. Right now as we speak, there are some cute little wolf pups in Utah, and to think otherwise is stupid, so lets give Ryan some more money!!




"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>Or maybe its you that isn't
>seeing the results: and its
>you with the problem.
>Some of us are seeing
>the results of what going
>on, but there are some
>like you that cant get
>the chip off of your
>shoulder and see the results.
>
The only thing stopping wolves in Utah is the lack of deer to eat. So I guess your right, $fw has been successful.

$fw's success in saving the deer in Utah is like Obamas recovery from recession.

Just have some coolaid, the mothership is on its way.

"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Hoss,
A big reason $FW has not been completely embraced by surrounding states, is because they all had the luxury of seeing the State of Utah completely sell out their soul to $FW, Don and his cronies. We gave all the other states a pretty darn good example of "what not to follow" when it comes to tag grabs (conservation tags), wildlife management, sportsmen opportunity, etc.

This has absolutely nothing to do with culture/religion - it has everything to do with Don and $FW strategically influencing/lobbying the right groups to gain significant control of decision making in Utah, including the DWR/Wildlife Board. It also has a whole lot to do with the majority of "regular joe" sportsmen/women not being involved enough to make a difference and have their voice truly heard. You have called that "blind faith" but I call that being apathetic, so you get what you get.
 
Here comes

Icy remarks and Mormon bashing. There are guys I work with who love doing it. I guess if I wanted to inform them H.R. might frown it would slow down.
 
RE: Here comes

I think there is a grain of truth when it comes to Utah being the scam artist capital and the culture, it also shows it their political choices.

I am a member of the church and was born in Utah, I'm not not trying to bash anything and certainly not all Utah folks are the same, but it's certainly a sad situation of facts for some of us.
 
hoss,

Great question? But it is the wrong conclusion. Even if you accept the premise that Mormons follow blindly, the concept of following blindly is not distinct to Utah. The principles that are advocated in this state may differ from other states, but the general public tends to follow blindly whatever the ruling class of their geographical region is. The wacko environmental movement is a perfect example. It has swept the whole country with a religious like fervor which has very little to do with facts. Yet people have jumped on blindly.

Your point of blindly following is a correct point, and your point that the predominant views in Utah trend differently than many areas of the country is also true. But you go astray when you assume that blindly following popular political trends is a disease limited to the State of Utah.

In the end, SFW is the conservative version of a wacko environmentalist activist group- hired guns hired to play in the gutter of politics and justified by the excuse that "it's just the way things are done".

I don't agree with it. But if you are insinuating that the underlying concept is a "Utard" creation, you're wrong. SFW is a Utah version of a very widespread form of corrupt activism modeled after what the liberal left has been doing for decades. If you want someone to blame for this type of activism, you can credit the liberal left for blazing the path.
 
Wolves and environmental groups?? Your funny wildman, how about speaking the truth.
In the end it will may be the environment groups that save the public land legacy.

The more I listen to hunters, the more afraid I become, instead of promoting conservation and stewardship of natural resources, all I seem to hear is me, myself and I and that's all that counts.
 
>hoss,
>
>Great question? But it is
>the wrong conclusion. Even
>if you accept the premise
>that Mormons follow blindly, the
>concept of following blindly is
>not distinct to Utah.
>The principles that are advocated
>in this state may differ
>from other states, but the
>general public tends to follow
>blindly whatever the ruling class
>of their geographical region is.
> The wacko environmental movement
>is a perfect example.
>It has swept the whole
>country with a religious like
>fervor which has very little
>to do with facts.
>Yet people have jumped on
>blindly.
>
>Your point of blindly following is
>a correct point, and your
>point that the predominant views
>in Utah trend differently than
>many areas of the country
>is also true. But
>you go astray when you
>assume that blindly following popular
>political trends is a disease
>limited to the State of
>Utah.
>
>In the end, SFW is the
>conservative version of a wacko
>environmentalist activist group- hired guns
>hired to play in the
>gutter of politics and justified
>by the excuse that "it's
>just the way things are
>done".
>
>I don't agree with it.
>But if you are insinuating
>that the underlying concept is
>a "Utard" creation, you're wrong.
> SFW is a Utah
>version of a very widespread
>form of corrupt activism modeled
>after what the liberal left
>has been doing for decades.
> If you want someone
>to blame for this type
>of activism, you can credit
>the liberal left for blazing
>the path.

I could have made the wrong conclussion, no doubt, and here is my Utah culture bias, $fw grew out of this state, and while I know otherwise I generally assume most of the guys in here are Utah based so i have that bias myself. I agree $fw does tract along some other groups, but they are a Utah disease, and they have florished in Utah, and there is a reason. If my logic about Utah culture is wrong, I have no emotional connection to the thought, but there IS a reason it is so successful here. And there is a reason that after all the debate and discussion about it, BGF follows right down the same path, and does so easily.

"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Been watching this for a few days before I had to wade in.

The CAT has a thread in the Campfire for the biggest MM plick,
I'm disappointed that Plickerton only has me as first runner up.
Let's get the win here.

It is absolutely 100% the culture here. You can't live in Utah and be
A Democrat. Further you can't live in Southern Utah and not have a persecution
Complex. Why do you think Peay goes after Noel and Okerlund to do his
Bidding. Drop a couple lines about city slickers from Salt Lake or the Feds
And whatever else follows is sure to be a success.

Why do y'all think land grab proponents always call it Federal Lands??
Cause if they told you idiots they were stealing your PUBLIC lands the
Sheeple would scatter.

Many of you would rather lose access to over 30 million acres of land that
You hunt, fish and camp on than be the guy in the neighborhood that voted
On issue rather than on what's "expected" to maintain your imaginary status "somewhere".

Pull your collective heads out of your asses. Educate yourselves.
Understand what a FACT is. As in its a fact Republican politicians
Are going to take the land you hunt and love. As in buck deer don't give birth and herd fecundity matters.

Proud to claim plick of the year for 2015. What's my prize?? A half million
Lobbing contract?!






"The State of Utah has not given BGF anything.
They have invested in BGF to protect their
interests."
Birdman 4/15/15
 
LAST EDITED ON May-01-15 AT 07:11PM (MST)[p]Careful there Wiley. If you keep talking logic and keep asking questions MM will hire Ryan to threaten you with a tresspassing lawsuit.

I actually relized (after my original post of course) that Utah has already paid Ryan enough therefor he could do the tresspass warning pro bono.

I am reminded of the movie the wizard of Oz. remember the line... ignore the man behind the curtain and obey the mighty and powerful OZ (Don/Ryan).
 
I'm a member of the LDS church. I know hundreds and hundreds of members. I talk about hunting/fishing in Utah more than anything. I have yet to have a fellow member tell me they are a member of SFW.

I live in Davis County though...where are most SFW members located..?

I think the issue is getting the word out to the general public. I know very little about SFW, their influence in politics, and so forth. I learn most of it here on MM. With the spread of social media, accountability has gone through the roof... Let's all hope this applies to the varying wilderness/hunting groups out there...

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
Still trying to figure out what I'm supposed to have a "f you" attitude about on this one? Conservation groups, LDS, animals, opinions, Utah?
 
Utah politics have taken an extremist turn over
the years, and this is the result, it does reflect badly on Mormon culture no doubt.

"Meet the Mormons" shouldn't mean a greasy hand shake from Ken Ivory.
 
>Hoss,
>A big reason $FW has not
>been completely embraced by surrounding
>states, is because they all
>had the luxury of seeing
>the State of Utah completely
>sell out their soul to
>$FW, Don and his cronies.
> We gave all the
>other states a pretty darn
>good example of "what not
>to follow" when it comes
>to tag grabs (conservation tags),
>wildlife management, sportsmen opportunity, etc.
>
>
>This has absolutely nothing to do
>with culture/religion - it has
>everything to do with Don
>and $FW strategically influencing/lobbying the
>right groups to gain significant
>control of decision making in
>Utah, including the DWR/Wildlife Board.
> It also has a
>whole lot to do with
>the majority of "regular joe"
>sportsmen/women not being involved enough
>to make a difference and
>have their voice truly heard.
> You have called that
>"blind faith" but I call
>that being apathetic, so you
>get what you get.

And yet despite all of that $FW almost got guaranteed landowner tags, more auction tags and bonus points implemented here in Idaho through legislation despite what the people of Idaho desire.
 
I am from Utah and people seem to vote by the party and not by the individual. That is why you will see these land grabbers get what they want is because they are Republican. I used to be a staunch Republican and started voting for the individual and not for the party. I found myself voting Republican nationally and then voting mainly Democratic locally. I find it nothing to do with the Faith of the State but might be wrong.

It is sad that our poloticians get voted in simply because they are Republican rather than what they stand for.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-03-15 AT 03:56PM (MST)[p]This is the epitome of what this site has become, an absolute joke. I miss the good ole days of monster muleys, congratulations, and hunting stories. All it is now is a people attacking someone or something, saying stupid almost "inside jokes" that no1 understands besides the "select few" who spend seemingly all day on this site, and stuff completely irrelevant to enjoying the outdoors. Bash me all you want, but it's the sad truth.

RIP Monster Muleys, I miss you.
 
Its one thing to see a problem and blame someone for it.
That is usually followed by complaining about the problem and those who have been blamed.

My question, is this all you can do about it?

I stopped joining "conservation groups" a few years ago. I had been a member of several different groups over my lifetime.

The reason I changed my opinion is because I just don't see the value.
Seems like what your dollar does is buy banquets for the wealthy to buy auction tags.

I believe that in all states, including Utah, there is a real attitude of greed that surrounds this issue.

How many hunters are there in Utah?
How many man hours get volunteered, in Utah, each year, working on hunting related improvement?
Not just Utah, all states. I am only bringing up the Utah thing because its the subject of this post.
Oh, don't count dedicated hunter hours. Thats my point.
Hunters generally have a "gotta get something" attitude of greed.

Not many will volunteer serious time and effort if they don't have an immediate payoff in their favor.

Thats why the SFW MDF RMEF NWTF DU ect. hold banquets with big prize raffles ect.
If the people really cared, they would donate not only the cash, but their time and work to make a difference.
But as human nature in this part of the world stands, you gotta get something for your dollar.

Of course, this is just how I see it. I could be wrong.

How can I prove my theory?
Well, don't we have the power to fix this?

If every hunter in the state petitioned the lawmakers in their state to stop auctioning tags to the ultra wealthy do you think they would ignore you?
If you find it morally wrong to have to go to the EXPO show to have a chance to win a raffle tag, then why do you go down there and do it anyways?
Because you have no choice? You gotta play their game if you want to win?

Really? is that what you call living life elevated?

Bottom line, people vote party lines and defend their party, even when their party is ruining the thing they claim to love most.
All the while, they have the power to change it.

Greed and laziness, and narcissism.

If every hunter in the state stopped going to banquets to "get prizes" and went there to plan future projects to do in their state, no one would show up.
It would be a room with three guys in it.

Who's fault is that?
Sorry to be so blunt with it, but your problem is not with Don Peay, or any other group or its leadership.
Your problem is with yourselves.

Look at the RMGA. How many guys do you think they had volunteer to do the Montana madison range goat survey?
The leadership is out there, doing work. They are asking for your help. They need you.
Your money and your time and effort.
But unless it comes in the form of a dinner banquet with the chance to win a free gun, or buy an auction tag, no one wants anything to do with it.

So, who has the power? Who takes the blame?

As for Utah?? Mormon or not. Republican or Democrat.
What does the way you live your life say about you?
Forget your labels.
Look at your actions. Are you a complainer, a blamer, or a fixer.

Collectively, we seem to be complainers and blamers.
There are a few individuals who try.

We will see what Utah is made of on June 19, 20, and 21. When Utah has the chance to help the RMGA do something that actually effects the tag numbers in the state.
I am betting that because there is no banquet, there will be minimal support.

Just like there was in Montana.

I don't mind the "conservation organizations" or their leadership.
I just wish that people cared enough to make the wildlife officials and the conservation organizations better.

As long as we allow corruption in the system, we have no one to blame but ourselves.
Even worse, as long as we participate in the corruption, we have no one to hate but ourselves.
 
SHEDYGAGA

I dont know who you are but you just hit the nail on the head and drove it home.
Thank you for taking the time to do that post.
 
SHEDYGAGA,

I have no problem with your statement or position, but I do have a problem with people who seem to think that these issues are unique to hunters or certain geographical regions. Most of the problems are rooted in human nature and are equally evident in public issues across the board. That is not an excuse, but it is also not justification for an excessively negative view of hunters.
 
SFW has a small following of common folks. So, this is not a culture thing at all.
You make is sound like everyone in the State has jumped on the SFW bandwagon and is a member. FALSE!

They have gone after the rich member, why?
-The rich guy wants tags to buy, and not wait. SO THEY LOVE SFW PLAN.
-The rich guy donates money, and hence sways politicians, SO THEY LOVE SFW.
-SFW is a lobby group, first and foremost!
-SFW does a few banquets, gives out some tags to the common folks, just to keep them interested.
-SFW went after Legislatures, with money, and promises of votes.

This is not a mormon culture thing at all, dumb to even think or consider that.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-07-15 AT 06:54AM (MST)[p]I think it has a link to Mormon culture, at least modern Mormon culture. The politicians the scams, the privatization schemes,and excessive commercialization of big game hunting all have links.

It's not the church that promotes such activities, but it's an outlet for human failings, a way to be selfish, hateful and greedy without specifically breaking the rules.
 
Several good posts in this thread. Just wanted to add that its a sad state of affairs everywhere with all things when it comes to politicians & special interest groups. The even sadder part is that some on here have yet to figure out the political coin is a double headed nickle and in the end if we the people do not limit their power and squash the influence of all special interest money we will all be looking through a fence with nothing to see but a keep out sign. Carry on.
 
First, good job to most of you, you didn't get defensive about your religion, I think most of the disscussion was what I hoped for and not a "Mormon Hater" rant.

I agree with some that your either a complainer or a fixer. I guess the issue, at least in Utah seems to be the devil you know vs. the one you don't.

When $fw was starting up, Byron Batemans son and I worked for the same contractor, he came around to the guys and discussed $fw and what they wanted to do. Being newly married and broke I passed on joining, although I had the intention to do so, I thought what they were wanting to do was great. I saw them fight with us on prop 5(get the number right?). I was impressed, and in fact figured that when we worked together in the near future I would join up. But then I started talking to other guys, some members, who discussed the shadiness that had already started way back then. THEN $fw started to attack the "average" guys. They supported tag cuts, they were pushing more LE, etc, etc.

So like many I thought I NEED to do something, I joined MDF. Yeah I know, but at the time the internet was a baby and research on these groups was hard, and I was a younger guy, construction was booming, in short I didn't do my homework. So you know where this goes.

I grew tired of NEEDING to do something, only to have my NEED turned into a ponzi scheme, or a power grab.

I joined DU, namely because they seem, in Utah anyway if you want to compare acreage saved, increased access, and increased opportunity, to be one group who flat gets it done.

My post is a reflection of my utter disgust of what big game hunting in Utah has become.
In the "family state" we have cut out the families in pursuit of a trophy.
In the "public land" state, we lock up the state with LE units and CWMU.
In the "self reliance" state we hand out hundreds and hundreds of tags as welfare.
ETC, ETC, ETC.

We sit, and watch as you HAVE to send Orrin, and Rob Bishop, and Chafetz back over and over. What have they done for wildlife? What have they done other than chase cameras? We watch as our "leaders" roll over continually, but brother Bishop, and brother Chafetz(yes I will spell it different every time), and now sister Love, "they are good, staunch republicans". They have so bastardized what conservative means, it has no meaning. See I don't see how changing one government manager(federal) for another(state) is anti government?

I am rambling. I used to listen to Tom Barbari. He talked over and over about how Utah politics is run like the mob, HE WAS RIGHT. I just always find it amazing how if your a Utah politician who is a Mormon, you believe your god only pays attention for 3 hours on Sunday, the other 6 days he must be blind? If you vote Republican in this state, you wasted a vote. Vote this issue, vote for access and hunting, not for the party that supposedly supports it, but for people WHO ACTUALLY DO, you will be suprised to see a non republican majority. In the very least, change your party affiliation to independent, NOT REPUBLICAN. Don't let the Utah Repulicans decide they need only talk Mormon, and talk anti fed and they are home free. My Mormon ancestors, the ones that came here, weren't a bunch of sheeple, they were FIERCELY independent, they left the world and came to this hell hole and built a state just to prove it. They actually were anti fed, to the point of being willing to fight(Johnsons army). They clawed, scratched, fought, and died to be different, to be INDEPENDENT. Now, you need only let it be known your a member in good standing, have a R next to your name, and every 2 or 6 years say something anti fed, and the "block" will follow. SAD.

Thanks, this discussion for the most part has been what I hoped for.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>Hoss you convinced me what day
>are we packing up and
>leaving this Mormon hell hole
>for California ?

"but mom, johnny is way worse than me", glad that your idea of frank conversation is to revert to logic my 4 year old twins use all the time. Yup, you got me, California is in worse shape than Utah. Of course in being a genius you forget that most of the reason is because California has a liberal, "environmentalist", block that votes for anything with a D by its name. Way to point out that this kind of mentality is the reason for the problem!!

Perhaps when your on your way to Wendover you can talk it out? Or maybe you can contribute some more to Idaho schools when you "stop for gas" in Malad. Or, while in Evanston, you can just go "enjoy watching horses run".

I know, being frank about issues, or ACTUALLY being open to looking at issues from ALL sides, not just the EASY ones(cuz everyone else says so) is scary.

Your right, we should pack up and go to california, perhaps about UEA time, Anaheim?


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>>Hoss you convinced me what day
>>are we packing up and
>>leaving this Mormon hell hole
>>for California ?
>
>"but mom, johnny is way worse
>than me", glad that
>your idea of frank conversation
>is to revert to logic
>my 4 year old twins
>use all the time.
>Yup, you got me, California
>is in worse shape than
>Utah. Of course in
>being a genius you forget
>that most of the reason
>is because California has a
>liberal, "environmentalist", block that votes
>for anything with a D
>by its name. Way
>to point out that this
>kind of mentality is the
>reason for the problem!!
>
>Perhaps when your on your way
>to Wendover you can talk
>it out? Or
>maybe you can contribute some
>more to Idaho schools when
>you "stop for gas" in
>Malad. Or, while in
>Evanston, you can just go
>"enjoy watching horses run".
>
>I know, being frank about issues,
>or ACTUALLY being open to
>looking at issues from ALL
>sides, not just the EASY
>ones(cuz everyone else says so)
>is scary.
>
>Your right, we should pack up
>and go to california, perhaps
>about UEA time, Anaheim?
>
>
>"The only thing that stops a
>bad guy with a gun
>is a good guy with
>a gun"

Hoss your hard to please I agree with you and you compare me to your 4 year old twins. They pro ly think your a whiner too! You go from SFW to Mormons to RvsD and want me to do a big write up about how I feel?i get on mm to read about hunts and such and I'll I've ever seen from you is whining and b itching !i agree 100% on gambling and lottery but theres a thing called majority rules.
Or at least there use to be! I joined SFW because they used to do lottery tags at the banquets and then those holier than thou Mormons made them stop!so if your pro gambling and such maybe we could agree on something ? And I gotta add " shouldn't this be in the political forum" so is it Nevada ,Idaho or Cali thanks
 
I used to get on here to read about hunts too. But after a while you notice a constant and continuous theme. "ITS ALL ABOUT ME, ALL THE TIME, SCREW EVERYONE ELSE". Perhaps it my kids, perhaps my age, perhaps my luck to have been in with the hunting group I am in, but thats not how I look at it, and really, not how the majority looks at it, HOWEVER, the majority doesn't live in camo, they are just normal folks, many who don't stay as involved as perhaps they should. THey get a flyer in the spring, head to the Salt Palace and try to win a "free" hunt. The thought that they are now included in some head count that $fw can use to pass their "spokesman for the masses" BS never dawns on them. They don't do any research, they don't dig into whats really going on. They BELIEVE that sportsmans groups are for ALL sportsmen, they believe there isn't some backroom, backslap deal behind decisions. They aren't dumb, they just don't live it like you and I. They are the guys some of us are trying to get to. They are the guys that IF they knew what was going down, could possibly turn things with just their numbers alone. They are the BLOCK that I speak of. The genius of $fw, and their clones, is that they speak in sound bites, they talk in bumper stickers. They are great at headlines, the ones they KNOW the majority will see and read, WITHOUT digging into the whole story. To them $fw is doing good work. TO them BGF is killing it in wolf lobbying, mainly because $fw and BGF told them so. THats the crowd that I personally and others are trying to poke, yell at, slap, convince, or even shame, into paying just a little attention. They are the block, and because of the culture, and its authoritarian, top down, non rebellious nature there is comfort in following along.
So coondog, I will ask you, are you a registered Republican? Are you part of the block that is counted on to go along and shut up?
Its not whining. Its wanting to preserve a way of life. A birthrite, a heritage. And if that means that I NEVER have a 30" buck, or 400 bull hanging on my wall, but my kids and grandkids have PUBLIC, WILD land to hunt, and tags to do so with, then I am more than happy. It ain't all about me, all the time.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 

Similar threads

highsierra
The most underrated deer hunt in CA?
Replies
42
Views
2k
Skykarp
Skykarp
elks96
Last one for the wall?
Replies
13
Views
1k
elks96
elks96
Rider47
One change to deer management
Replies
38
Views
973
BradA
BradA

Click-a-Pic ... Details & Bigger Photos

Member Gallery Photos and Videos!

IMG_1460.JPG
68D74335-A373-4098-9229-ADB1CF465871.jpeg
KIMG0380.JPG
SkyRose1.jpg
jwb3.jpg
20230917_082305.jpg
6F4BE571-7CFC-4BF5-82A1-13D9BB4DD87E.jpeg
135018C6-AC09-4C7C-9B0E-12C18D6CDCDC.jpeg
67543EC9-2D8F-4DB2-974A-A3436951EB96.jpeg
93F29953-E41F-4BB6-8567-ED7923C44962.jpeg
B9AE778D-502F-4215-A221-BDCD7C88AB81.jpeg
842331A8-3085-4810-8749-B75FAE795562.jpeg
Back
Top Bottom