Mike Lee's Next Anti-Public Land Scheme

grizzly

Long Time Member
Messages
5,598
Excellent Op-Ed in SLTrib today...

Sen. Mike Lee has proposed yet another scheme to sell off public lands in the state of Utah.

Faced with an underfunded public school system, Lee argues that tracts of public land in the Beehive State could be auctioned off in order to bolster funding for public education.

Sportsmen and women and communities across our state place a high value in our public lands, including those that aren't national parks, designated wilderness areas or national monuments. Although they might not boast the tens of millions of tourists seen by Zion or Bryce Canyon, the acres targeted by Lee are where we hunt, fish, run dogs and camp with our families. They have sustained communities for generations and provide critical public access for citizens from across the country.

These lands also provide essential habitat and winter range for the threatened sage grouse as well as elk, deer and antelope ? species upon which Utah?s sportsmen and women depend.

These lands are also integral to our outdoor recreation economy, which at last count topped $12.3 billion in Utah alone. They?re a sustainable source of revenue for counties and municipalities across the state.

In 2018, the Payment in Lieu of Taxes program, or PILT, which compensates counties with federal lands that don't provide property taxes, raised $40.7 million for Utah counties supporting essential services including education, law enforcement, wildfire management and health care.

Lee?s plan is tantamount to selling the cow to buy milk. It's a short-term gain that will ultimately devastate rural economies that depend on hunting, fishing and outdoor recreation as sustainable sources of revenue year after year.

Federal lands are also managed for multiple uses that generate additional revenues from resource extraction, grazing and more sustainable leasing programs that support farmers and ranchers. If our public lands are sold to the highest bidder, there's no guarantee that wealthy landowners and private industry will continue to support working ranch families, and if they do, market prices for grazing privileges on private lands are often 10 times more than the bargain rate federal agencies charge per animal unit month.

Lee chose to frame his argument around Utah?s children. Yes, our public school system needs help. But other funding sources exist that will not lead to the privatization of our state?s incredible natural resources. The next generation of Utahans will depend on our public lands the same way I have: as a source of food, income and endless opportunities in the outdoors.

We can't let our kids be used as a pawn in Sen. Lee?s long-running campaign to divest Utah of our public lands.

Please stand with me and the Utah Chapter of Backcountry Hunters & Anglers in asking Sen. Lee to focus on real solutions to fund education, leave our public lands alone and let our outdoor economy continue to thrive.


-Perry Hall?is vice chair of the Utah Chapter of Backcountry Hunters and Anglers, a 501c(3) nonprofit dedicated to protecting public lands for all users. He spends any free time he has hunting, fishing, mountain biking and skiing on public lands.

https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/commentary/2019/11/09/perry-hall-lees-plan/

PS. You guys can have the complaints in the world about National BHA, but the local guys are above reproach. Perry is a great guy!
 
Perry should clean his own house before he looks outside. Did you really expect anything less?

#livelikezac
 
The public land grab isn't going away anytime soon with the likes of Lee still around, even though it is part of the republican platform. It sucks and I don't know how it can be overcome. Figures Utah leads the charge...
 
The best way to fund public schools is to allow casinos, state lotteries, and tax marijuana. They receive a never ending supply of money. Ask California who ranks about number 48th in the nation in education.

Utah needs to wake up and get with the program. Leave public land alone.
 
"Faced with an underfunded public school system, Lee argues that tracts of public land in the Beehive State could be auctioned off in order to bolster funding for public education."

Short term answer and doesn't solve the problem. It's like winning a $25,000 lottery. You can take an expensive vacation, but what are you going to do next year?

When will these UT politicians get off this public lands transfer kick?

As long as the Lee's, Bishop's, and Romney's are elected, there won't be a change. Why does UT keep electing these quack's...?
 
>
>Why does UT keep electing
>these quack's...?

Because they're Mormons and they have an R next to their name. That's all it takes to win an election in Utah.

You can get rid of Lee and elect another Mormon republican and that person would want to sell off our public lands too. They?re all cut from the same cookie cutter.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-10-19 AT 10:32AM (MST)[p]>"Faced with an underfunded public school
>system, Lee argues that tracts
>of public land in the
>Beehive State could be auctioned
>off in order to bolster
>funding for public education."
>
>Short term answer and doesn't solve
>the problem. It's like
>winning a $25,000 lottery.
>You can take an expensive
>vacation, but what are you
>going to do next year?
>
>

You're correct but it's even more sinister and insidious than that. It's because once public (range) land is sold they'll get property tax revenue from it. That's the ongoing financial gain they seek... more money into government coffers. (Which obviously wouldn't exist of it remained "state-owned" which they won't guarantee because they have no intent of that happening. The State already has set up bank accounts to hold funds from the sale of newly-gained public land.)

Sadly, the average rancher that is supporting this won't be the guy to buy the land and will either lose his lease or have the price increase exponentially to a Fair Market Rate.

The Lee's of the world have convinced ranchers to slit their own throats in blind loyalty to a Party... all while the politicians take millions in donations from the folks that will actually buy the land.

Grizzly

-----------------------------------------

Ask yourself if you agree with the following statement...

"It's time to revisit the widely accepted principle in the United States and Canada that game is a public resource."
-Don Peay, Founder of SFW, as quoted in Anchorage Daily News
 
California actually did that back when it first became a state. A lot of land was given to fund education through wise use, in perpetuity. Crooked politicians and judges sold most of it to timber companies for $50/acre, big money back then. Now schools have to have bake sales just to buy pencils and paper for the kids. Don't do it Utah.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-10-19 AT 11:18AM (MST)[p]Cut off the Mormon - Bashing. It isn't any nice than race bashing and doesn't make people who do it look better. There is an entire country of politicians from every religion and Atheists too. I see no benefit from bashing them.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Nov-10-19
>AT 11:18?AM (MST)

>
>Cut off the Mormon - Bashing.
> It isn't any nice
>than race bashing and doesn't
>make people who do it
>look better. There is an
>entire country of politicians from
>every religion and Atheists too.
>I see no benefit from
>bashing them.


I see no bashing of Mormons in what he said.

He answered the previous question of why ?we? as Utahans continue to elect people like them. He said nothing that was demeaning or degrading about said religion.
 
Dearmadness, did you happen to catch the debate between the 3 candidates vying for Jason Chaffetz job after he quit?

It was incredible, it was like 3 Chaffetz debating against each other. It literally didn't matter which one won. Utah got rid of Chaffetz only to replace him with another Chaffetz.
 
Perry is a good dude.

It would be fascinating to see how much Utah has contributed to Idaho school system over the years in lotto.

Same with Wyoming.

It's not bashing Mormons to say they vote Republican, they do.

Mitt Romney is from Michigan, his only "claim" to Utah is his religion.

Mike Lee is from Washigton DC, but he to is from the majority religion.

So, they are electable.

Utah's schools are underfunded because Utah has a ton of kids for one.

Second, have you seen the new schools in Utah? The amount of money spent on buildings is unbelievable. The new high schools and jr highs in Davis county are the most expensive buildings in the county. Complete with ofc the charts costs in engineering and design. Each one has to be more outlandish than the prior. As if architecture teaches kids.

But, much as California is off the charts with one party rule, the antithesis is Utah with its one party rule.

Last. It will be interesting to see how much more in sin taxes Utah takes in now that we don't have to run to wendover, malad, or Evanston for beer.



From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
>>
>>Why does UT keep electing
>>these quack's...?
>
>Because they're Mormons and they have
>an R next to their
>name. That's all it takes
>to win an election in
>Utah.
>
>You can get rid of Lee
>and elect another Mormon republican
>and that person would want
>to sell off our public
>lands too. They?re all
>cut from the same cookie
>cutter.

Maybe all the people who would actually win the election are. I fit the stereo type you described. Mormon, Republican (I actually am more party-less now, both parties are idiots). I do not ever want any of our public land sold and I have supported groups that are fighting it and sent a large amount of emails to our congressman asking them to stop trying to sell off our lands.
 
>>>
>>>Why does UT keep electing
>>>these quack's...?
>>
>>Because they're Mormons and they have
>>an R next to their
>>name. That's all it takes
>>to win an election in
>>Utah.
>>
>>You can get rid of Lee
>>and elect another Mormon republican
>>and that person would want
>>to sell off our public
>>lands too. They?re all
>>cut from the same cookie
>>cutter.
>
>Maybe all the people who would
>actually win the election are.
>I fit the stereo type
>you described. Mormon, Republican (I
>actually am more party-less now,
>both parties are idiots). I
>do not ever want any
>of our public land sold
>and I have supported groups
>that are fighting it and
>sent a large amount of
>emails to our congressman asking
>them to stop trying to
>sell off our lands.

Change your "official" affiliation to I. Send a message to Lee, Bishop, Romney letting them know you did because of their public land stance.

You can still vote however you want.

Right now they just know how many R are in their district, and really don't care about anything else, unless you have a big checkbook.






From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
LAST EDITED ON Nov-11-19 AT 09:44AM (MST)[p]Changing your affiliation to Independent only prevents you from voting in the election where there is actually a chance of making a change.

I used to be a registered independent because I simply can't stand any of the political parties and know that none of them even pretend to try and represent me, but then I didn't get to vote in the elections in my state that actually matter. Can?t vote in republican primary without being a registered member.

Kind of a catch 22.
 
You will find that the more money you pour into the schools, the more they will demand in the future. Only problem is that most of that money does not filter down to the teachers and students. Most of it is spent by the upper echelon of the education system.

I have a son and daughter-in-law that are teachers here in CA. and they have advised me that very little of the funds make it down to the classroom.

CA. has been pouring money into the education system for years and they still yell they need more, yet our students are getting a piss poor education in public schools.

RELH
 
>Changing your affiliation to Independent only
>prevents you from voting in
>the election where there is
>actually a chance of making
>a change.
>
>I used to be a registered
>independent because I simply can't
>stand any of the political
>parties and know that none
>of them even pretend to
>try and represent me, but
>then I didn't get to
>vote in the elections in
>my state that actually matter.
>Can?t vote in republican primary
>without being a registered member.
>
>
>Kind of a catch 22.

My thoughts as well. Registering Republican is the only way to try and get moderates in the ballot instead of the firebrands. Herbert, Romney, and Curtis were all beat at the caucus level because the most involved are the furthest out of touch with the average voter. I keep my affiliation as R, but then vote as I see best.

Grizzly

-----------------------------------------

Ask yourself if you agree with the following statement...

"It's time to revisit the widely accepted principle in the United States and Canada that game is a public resource."
-Don Peay, Founder of SFW, as quoted in Anchorage Daily News
 
>LAST EDITED ON Nov-11-19
>AT 09:44?AM (MST)

>
>Changing your affiliation to Independent only
>prevents you from voting in
>the election where there is
>actually a chance of making
>a change.
>
>I used to be a registered
>independent because I simply can't
>stand any of the political
>parties and know that none
>of them even pretend to
>try and represent me, but
>then I didn't get to
>vote in the elections in
>my state that actually matter.
>Can?t vote in republican primary
>without being a registered member.
>
>
>Kind of a catch 22.



Agreed.

But we both know that for the most part it's a head count.

So many R
So many D

Time and money are spent on those that aren't.

Second. Primaries for Senator in Utah in regards to public land, are meaningless. Same for guns, abortion, Hill field, etc, etc.

There's not a snowballs chance the repubs would primary Lee.

From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 
If we want to get rid of the Mike Lee's and carpet-bagging Romneys of Utah, the best way to do so is to get rid of straight-party balloting. Only eight states still allow this and it needs to be abolished. If people are too lazy to read an entire ballot they shouldn't be voting. Being able to check a box with an R or D at the top of the ballot is ridiculous.
 
>Wow. Didn't realize my question
>would result in a debate
>on political theology.


You didn't expect a question about why someone was elected to result in answers on political theology?

Wow. That's amazing, actually.
 
>>
>>Why does UT keep electing
>>these quack's...?
>
>Because they're Mormons and they have
>an R next to their
>name. That's all it takes
>to win an election in
>Utah.
>
>You can get rid of Lee
>and elect another Mormon republican
>and that person would want
>to sell off our public
>lands too. They?re all
>cut from the same cookie
>cutter.

Who did you vote for? The tranny checker?? Your junk yard disposition towards Mormons has less to do with factual basis and more to do with the empty crock pot on your shoulders. I didn't know Utah still held such a handy percentage. Also if you could point to the place where you extrapolate this idea they all vote for the R it would help is to see it your way. If it's D?s you looking for, political or actual d?s, California is a short drive.


4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
>>>>
>>>>Why does UT keep electing
>>>>these quack's...?
>>>
>>>Because they're Mormons and they have
>>>an R next to their
>>>name. That's all it takes
>>>to win an election in
>>>Utah.
>>>
>>>You can get rid of Lee
>>>and elect another Mormon republican
>>>and that person would want
>>>to sell off our public
>>>lands too. They?re all
>>>cut from the same cookie
>>>cutter.
>>
>>Maybe all the people who would
>>actually win the election are.
>>I fit the stereo type
>>you described. Mormon, Republican (I
>>actually am more party-less now,
>>both parties are idiots). I
>>do not ever want any
>>of our public land sold
>>and I have supported groups
>>that are fighting it and
>>sent a large amount of
>>emails to our congressman asking
>>them to stop trying to
>>sell off our lands.
>
>Change your "official" affiliation to I.
> Send a message to
>Lee, Bishop, Romney letting them
>know you did because of
>their public land stance.
>
>You can still vote however you
>want.
>
>Right now they just know how
>many R are in their
>district, and really don't care
>about anything else, unless you
>have a big checkbook.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN,
>PUBLIC LAND.

Yeah that worked out well for the Ross Perot strategy.


4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
>Sorry my bad. I didn't jump
>though and I haven't been
>a model citizen always but
>I do know some great
>people. Sorry..


Don?t feel bad. He is never going to get over his hard campaign work for Misty.

4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
I fully support Mike Lee and all he has done to hold Washington accountable. It doesn't mean I like every position he takes, but he is the best senator from Utah in a long, long time. It seems the out spoken liberals on this forum always try to find the wedge issue...

I have no use for Romney, and wish he would go back to Massachusetts. It is not a religious issue with me at all, but I suppose I am not the typical Utah voter. I will continue to support Lee and work to get him re-elected when the time comes.

Bill
 
>>Wow. Didn't realize my question
>>would result in a debate
>>on political theology.
>
>
>You didn't expect a question about
>why someone was elected to
>result in answers on political
>theology?
>
>Wow. That's amazing, actually.

Maybe I should've inserted a "tongue-in-cheek" emoji to my post?
 
>I fully support Mike Lee and
>all he has done to
>hold Washington accountable. It doesn't
>mean I like every position
>he takes, but he is
>the best senator from Utah
>in a long, long time.
>It seems the out spoken
>liberals on this forum always
>try to find the wedge
>issue...
>
>I have no use for Romney,
>and wish he would go
>back to Massachusetts. It
>is not a religious issue
>with me at all, but
>I suppose I am not
>the typical Utah voter. I
>will continue to support Lee
>and work to get him
>re-elected when the time comes.
>
>
>Bill


What EXACTLY has he done? He talks a lot. But what has he DONE?


From the party of HUNTIN, FISHIN, PUBLIC LAND.
 

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