Now the link is gone

[DeerMadness]

I expected that when this scenario plays out a SWAT Team rolls in. There were enough cops to lay down protective fire with armor and high power weapons. You can't have someone taking aim at leisure for 75 minutes. There was ample time for a plan and ensuing actions by a team that was willing to act.
A head has to roll for it. I understand that they are trying to justify their lack of action by changing stories and not being forthright. Just have candor so that it can improve when or if it happens again. Tell them what happened in truth so it won't happen again. Don't lie for your own sake. Step up to the plate because it wasn't a platoon of men in there with weapons. It was kids who needed to go home. You can't reverse the events but you can help in every way to adjust and improve.

 

[RELH]

Training and policy does normally dictate to run to the gunfire. The problem is if a poor leader countermands that policy for one reason or another as it appears to have happen here.
Law enforcement has a semi-military structure and direct commands from a senior or higher ranking officer are taken very seriously. To disobey is grounds for termination. An officer may get away with disobeying a illegal order that violates the law, but that is about it.
I am willing to bet there will be officers from that incident that will resign and get out of law enforcement due to guilty feelings about not going in to save those kids by disobeying that chief's order if he gave it.
RELH

 

[Utah400Elk]

The Monday morning quarterbacking is awesome. I have been in Law enforcement for over 25 years. The videos and news clips look bad. Not arguing that. Some of the initial information that was dispatched to law enforcement was that the situation have evolved from a active shooter into barricaded suspect. The department will have training and tactics that dictate their response. There will be a noticeable difference between the two scenarios.

There will be ample review of this situation. I have strong feelings and beliefs based on what I have seen so far but…I don’t have all the info. Grandstanding on how you would have responded is great and all, but in my experience, the end result never really fits with the stories that are told. The news will spin the story to meet their needs (muck-racking is well known news organization strategy).

Just look at the Covington Catholic News story broke with the false racism claims. It took time to get the real story out. Remember the were video snippets that appeared to be derogatory towards the students. Same thing is happening in this instance). I have not read the Departments policy and training memos regarding active shooter and barricade suspects. However, I do know for a fact (I have seen the real time police briefing) that the active shooter had turned into a barricaded suspect situation that stressed it was not an active shooter scenario.

In my time in law enforcement leadership, I have actually responded to over a dozen mass shooting scenes. The initial intel and new reports have never captured the reality of the chaos and evolving situation. Just my opinion as a guy with over 25 years LE experience.

 

[Utah400Elk]

I expected that when this scenario plays out a SWAT Team rolls in. There were enough cops to lay down protective fire with armor and high power weapons. You can't have someone taking aim at leisure for 75 minutes. There was ample time for a plan and ensuing actions by a team that was willing to act.
A head has to roll for it. I understand that they are trying to justify their lack of action by changing stories and not being forthright. Just have candor so that it can improve when or if it happens again. Tell them what happened in truth so it won't happen again. Don't lie for your own sake. Step up to the plate because it wasn't a platoon of men in there with weapons. It was kids who needed to go home. You can't reverse the events but you can help in every way to adjust and improve.

This has to be one of the silliest statements I have ever seen. Are you actually advocating for law enforcement to “lay down protective fire with armor and high powered weapons” in a occupied school. Police shoot to stop a threat. Only Military forces “lay down protective fire”. Police are accountable for every round they fire. Just shooting protective fire in an occupied school is just such a terrible idea. Carry on.

 

[Tristate]

Utah 400elk,

This is a disgusting embarrassing 5hitshow. If someone was trying to rebrand the situation as a "barricaded subject " then that person was an idiot and needs to be removed from law enforcement.

There actually has been story after disproven story given to the press from law enforcement. We have tried and tried again to make it look like this was just an evil murderer and police facing a series of unfortunate hurdles. The more the pile of crap ferments the more we realize almost every officer FAILED IN THEIR DUTY 100% TO "PROTECT AND SERVE".

We have videos. We have time lines. We have reports issued by the state authorities. THEY FAILED. FAILED. FAILED. FAILED. FAILED. FAILED.

For the sake of 21 murdered people, quit defending FAILURES, and start planning how to avoid these failures in the future.

 

[Tristate]

Head of Texas Department of Public Safety says Uvalde police response was an 'abject failure'

The head of the Texas Department of Public Safety says three minutes after a gunman entered a school where he slaughtered 19 elementary students and two teachers there was sufficient armed law enforcement on scene to stop the gunman.

www.pbs.org

NOW FIX IT!

 

[DeerMadness]

This has to be one of the silliest statements I have ever seen. Are you actually advocating for law enforcement to “lay down protective fire with armor and high powered weapons” in a occupied school. Police shoot to stop a threat. Only Military forces “lay down protective fire”. Police are accountable for every round they fire. Just shooting protective fire in an occupied school is just such a terrible idea. Carry on.

Protective fire if the shooter aims at the cops and they have a clear shot. I would assume they are trained ? Oh, if they just work at Walmart then I retract that ...

 

[Utah400Elk]

It’s not worth my time. Have a great weekend and be safe. Best of luck this hunting season.

 

[wetmule]

Anyone know, follow or train with Mike Glover & his company out of Heber City? Former Green Beret special forces & CIA operator who now trains law enforcement & agencies all over the country. His take on Uvalde is worth a look on his youtube channel. Met him in AZ a few months ago at a Sig Sauer event... really good dude!

This is a shorter followup to a much longer video he posted, also worth a look & can be accessed via this same link

 

[Tristate]

It’s not worth my time. Have a great weekend and be safe. Best of luck this hunting season.

If you have 25 years in law enforcement then figuring out how to avoid this in the future IS %100 "WORTH YOUR TIME"!

It's highly likely the entire reason we are having this discussion is that several dozen badged members of the "4uck-around gang" decided 21 dead people wasn't "worth their time".

FIX IT! FIX IT OR THE CIVILIANS ARE GOING TO FIX IT.

 

[Ropinfool]

"Do you want to come home to yours at the end of your work day? Yeah, most others do too. I'm positive you care more about your kids than the neighbor kids down the road, and rightfully so.

Difference is your ass isn't on the line for 54k a year."

THEY SHOULD FIND ANOTHER JOB THEN!!! IF THIS IS THEIR CHOSEN LINE OF WORK THEN THEY NEED TO PERFORM UP TO THE EXPECTATIONS OF THE JOB, SERVE AND PROTECT THE PUBLIC. COWARDS ALL OF THEM!

 

[BuzzH]

"Do you want to come home to yours at the end of your work day? Yeah, most others do too. I'm positive you care more about your kids than the neighbor kids down the road, and rightfully so.

Difference is your ass isn't on the line for 54k a year."

THEY SHOULD FIND ANOTHER JOB THEN!!! IF THIS IS THEIR CHOSEN LINE OF WORK THEN THEY NEED TO PERFORM UP TO THE EXPECTATIONS OF THE JOB, SERVE AND PROTECT THE PUBLIC. COWARDS ALL OF THEM!

Fire them all, good luck finding any replacements that are better.

They can't fill open vacancies now.

Good luck with that.

 

[elkassassin]

But Tog Still Blames The Type Of Weapon!

With The Time They Let The Shooter Have He Could'of Killed hundreds With a F'N FlintLock!

 

[RELH]

My sheriff's dept. that serves a county of about 60,000 has 7 vacant slots open for patrol. Has been vacant for some time. The dept is even offering a $10,000 sign up bonus for officers that have been to the basic academy and still have most of those open slots not filled.
My Grandfather was elected sheriff in 1928. I retired as a detective Sgt. after 30 years service. My oldest son is a patrol Sgt, His son recently completed the basic police academy and is taking college courses for his degree in criminal justice.
Two years ago when my grandson informed me that he wanted to go into law enforcement like his Father and Grandfather, I tried to talk him out of it. I failed on that and did get him to agree to only seek employment at departments that have a history of backing their officers and to stay out of liberal cities here in CA.
He agreed to that.
RELH