The Hunting Industry ??????

[Founder]

So in another thread, "Renting Optics", there's some talk about the hunting business and I was mentioning to my wife this morning how #####'s Sporting Goods stock took a big hit recently in part because the hunting goods sales weren't too good.
I was explaining to her how I felt the hunting industry as a whole is a risky and tough market, primarily because it's an industry that really can't grow it's customer numbers much because hunting is based on a resource (the game) that is shrinking.....certainly not growing.
It would be like trying to grow the golfing industry if no more golf courses could be built and the current courses were already full. How do you recruit more players if there isn't room to play?

What's your take on all this? Is firing up another online hunting store a good business venture? Is there room for more businesses out there selling hunting packs, hunting rifles, camo, etc.? How about more hunting magazines, or websites?
How do the guides and outfitters feel? Is there room for more guides in the units you operate in?

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
Will you LIKE MonsterMuleys.com on Facebook! I need a friend....

 

[mntman]

There isn't necessarily enough room for more but I hope new business keep joining in, because it creates competition, keeps prices lower (hopefully), brings in new product ideas etc...

Without competition, industries will become stagnate and poorly represented, plus it doesn't force them to stay financially responsible.

Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?

 

[elkfromabove]

LAST EDITED ON Jun-27-14 AT 10:10AM (MST)[p]Although the business as a whole may not see growth, individual companies within the industry can grow simply by producing a newer, better product. I have a friend that is doing very well in the farm implement industry even though there are fewer farmers every year because he invented and is producing a hay baling machine that correctly moisturizes the rows ahead of the baler so the farmer can bale hay in the middle of a hot day without having to wait for the proper natural morning dew. And thus the farmer can get an extra cutting or two per year. As far as I know, my friend is the only one building them.

If you build it, they will come, even though there may be fewer of them (He only needed 9 in the movie).

Edited: For you farmers: StaheliWest DewPoint 6110

 

[Zeke]

I agree with the other posters.
There's room for more but to survive they'd better be willing to push the "also-ran" out of the market share.

Over the past 45+ years of big game hunting I've often wished for certain products. Now we have those products thanks to someone with money and a brain... and a little guts.

I love some of the products but I'm not a big fan of the "industry" of hunting. There are many parts of the "industry" which have cheapened the experience. The commercialization of hunting is a bad thing from my perspective.

TV shows, endorsements, celebrities, big money, bed-partners in the industry all kind of leave a poop taste in my mouth.

Hunting is such a personal experience that all the hoopla (look at me, look at me) is almost too much for this old dog.

Zeke

 

[BeanMan]

Elkfromabove, I could actually gets some sleep during haying with this. Very cool.

 

[elkfromabove]

>Elkfromabove, I could actually gets
>some sleep during haying with
>this. Very cool.

Or more importantly, some hunting or fishing!

 

[ColoradoBob]

How much stuff do you need? Buy good quality and will last. I don't need all the hype they are peddling. My Model 700 & Leupold VarX-III were top notch back in 79----still plenty good. Bought a Denver Wall Tent---no need to replace. Leica Bicno's--no need to get anything else. Spotting scope is good.

Buy good quality the 1st time.

 

[Stonefly]

Go into any archery shop and you will be amazed at how your top of the line bow from 2 years ago is now not capable of harvesting even the smallest field mouse. And your old standby broadheads would need a good sized hammer to drive it through warm butter. Oh, and by the way, That sent free totally invisible Camo you bought last year... well now it looks like a skunk sented neon flashing sign to big game.. But they will have not only the newest (and very expensive)Bow, broadheads, and magic camo, that not only is the GREATEST, but will almost guarantee 180 class Mule Deer and 375 Elk. All you need is some freezer wrap.

 

[Castnshoot]

Founder, You should start an exchange where one MMer can rent all types of hunting gear from another MMer.

You make a small cordenator fee. It could all be done from your computer. No invetory or real cash out put needed.

There is affordable insuance that can be sold for this type of thing. You get a cut of that as well.

Take a look a www.airbnb.com .. That will give you a good idea how something like this works. I use them all the time, it works great.

A win win for everyone!

Except some of your add buyers

 

[nfh]

A new website or store would have to compete very well. hunting gear is very pricey. Then I discovered Amazon. Free shipping. big name products. Its hard to compete with that

 

[elkassassin]

New Inventions/Technology always keep it going!

This year we have affordable DRONES!

By next year We'll be able to shoot from Our Drones!

Some day you won't even have to leave the House!

I thought Leaving the House was what it's all about?

That 85K HoverCraft is Tempting!

And it'd be alright till some Jealous Bastard shot you out of the air!










[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!

 

[Castnshoot]

http://rentadrone.com/

 

[happytohunt]

As far as I am concerned you have already provided a valuable service by creating this website...perhaps hunting industry can maintain if not grow via youth recruitment via habitat improvement projects?Contests such as best habitat improvement projects etc.Take a kid hunting, work with the disabled, also "good deeds by hunters." I am rambling now but at least I am not trying to make the situation worse on purpose.Hth

 

[happytohunt]

Also I second what Colorado Bob says..

 

[Hawkeye]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-01-14 AT 10:42AM (MST)[p]I like the saying, "there is always room at the top." If you do something well, you will be successful. You may, however, put some other less organized and less competitive company out of business.

Hawkeye

Browning A-Bolt 300 Win Mag
Bowtech Destroyer
Winchester Apex .50 Cal

 

[cabinfever]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-01-14 AT 01:35PM (MST)[p]It aint rocket science. Create a website that is user friendly and stocked with all the items hunters like to buy. Offer the best prices with a killer return policy and A1 customer service and your well on your way to being successful.

 

[Waygoner]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-02-14 AT 07:32AM (MST)[p]One big thing that's going to hurt hunting and the outdoor business in general is the lack of interest by youth. Kids these days just aren't getting into hunting and the outdoors. They're too busy with their phones, iPad, Xbox, etc. The fear of being 'disconnected' for a day, let a lone a weekend is crippling. The demographic is aging and the total number of hunters is going to drop off. I believe this is the biggest threat for anyone working in a hunting related business.

 

[heffe]

Your best bet for a hunting related business is to develop a new product or improve upon an existing one. Not selling someone else's gear. There are thousands of outlets that already do that.

See the Outdoorsman's in Phoenix. They have a line of tripods, adapters, etc that they designed, MFG and sell. People complain / whine about their prices, but it is top of the line stuff and has a market. Same as the all the new technical clothing geared towards hunters. Pricey but marketable.

 

[Buckdownwind]

>So in another thread, "Renting Optics",
>there's some talk about the
>hunting business and I was
>mentioning to my wife this
>morning how #####'s Sporting Goods
>stock took a big hit
>recently in part because the
>hunting goods sales weren't too
>good.
>I was explaining to her how
>I felt the hunting industry
>as a whole is a
>risky and tough market, primarily
>because it's an industry that
>really can't grow it's customer
>numbers much because hunting is
>based on a resource (the
>game) that is shrinking.....certainly not
>growing.
>It would be like trying to
>grow the golfing industry if
>no more golf courses could
>be built and the current
>courses were already full. How
>do you recruit more players
>if there isn't room to
>play?
>
>What's your take on all this?
>Is firing up another online
>hunting store a good business
>venture? Is there room for
>more businesses out there selling
>hunting packs, hunting rifles, camo,
>etc.? How about more hunting
>magazines, or websites?
>How do the guides and outfitters
>feel? Is there room for
>more guides in the units
>you operate in?
>
>Brian Latturner
>MonsterMuleys.com
>Will you LIKE MonsterMuleys.com on Facebook!
>I need a friend....
------------------------------
Brian, I have to agree with you. Add to that the hunters hunting are dropping as much as 7% per year depending on which game animals you are hunting and where. The States Game and fish department which were taking the I don't care if they come back he to hunt next year attitude of the late 90's is now saying, " What do we do to lure more hunters to our state" and the hunting dollars are drying up like death Valley during a drought.
You will see some of them now and all of them in the next 10 years host aggressive campaigns to bring more women, handicapped hunters and youths in to hunting activities since traditionally those are the areas with the most growth potential. I look at the hunters that I have been working with for the last 15 years putting them on big bucks and bulls and Brian, they are gray like me. No longer able to leap tall buildings in a single bound. They are wearing out.
Now in the eye of the hunter competing with them for licenses, vouchers, private land and game animals they will say secretly, that a good thing.
The problem is the game and fish government agencies that ran on fat for years are trying to pay for the late 1990's structures with the increasingly dwindling income.
The bad side for each of us still hunting Brian is that you will see increased licenses prices and anything they can to increase their falling revenue string.
You may have the advantage during license draw, and in the field, but if you look closely you will be carrying his financial body in your back pack every time you hunt. You will need to have a backpack to carry the load you seldom see government downsize today.
Greg Merriam
Master Hunt Broker
Master Land Owner Voucher Broker
Discounted Hunts LLC
Outdoor Writers LLC
Pro-Staff Dead Down Wind Scent Products
Pro-Staff Benchmaster Shooting Accuracy Products
1204 Button Rock Drive
Longmont, Co 80504
303-776-7528 Voice
303-746-1214 Cell Phone
Skype: discountedhunts
Email: [[email protected]]
Web Page: [ http://www.discountedhunts.net]
Web Page for Vouchers This is the Link to the land Owner Voucher List
[http://www.discountedhunts.net/Pages/LandownerVouchers.aspx]

 

[tx_packmule]

I think the hunting industry upswings & downturns are more regional trends than anything.

Decreasing animal populations in certain areas will have a negative impact on the local industry, there's just no way around that.

 

[BrowningRage]

Most hunting products I see are way over priced for my hunting budget, and frankly, should be overpriced for anyone. ($400 for a shell jacket or pair of pants..??!! Really..??) I'd rather have another gun or two and wear my old army pants...

I won't be spending that kind of money ever, no matter how much money I make because its ridiculous. When prices come down, I'll consider it, but for now all that Sitka Gear, Custom Rifles, Yeti Coolers, $20 broadheads, $1500 bows, etc, etc... The number of people out there who can truly afford all that high priced stuff is dwindling in this economy. And those who can't afford it are realizing it soon after they purchase the stuff. They try and hock it on KSL and stuff, always wanting what it costs new, minus $30... Fools.

Have a great 4th of July

"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24

 

[AWHOLELOTTABULL]

I think you are right Brian. The hunting industry is based on a shrinking resource. If you don't have animals or oportunity to hunt then you don't have an "industry". My take on the whole thing is this......over the years it's become so comercialized and competitive that there are instances where it has run individual hunters and businesses right out of the industry. I've come really close to turning in my rifles and bows for tri bikes, wetsuits and spandex. Except for a few instances, the comradery (sp?) in the hunting industry is nearly nonexistant. In contrast, the extreme sport industry is growing exponentially and the comradery is amazing. There are not too many instances in any industry where the profesionals are extremely helpful to the rookies. I can almost bet you won't see Jim Shockey out on public land stopping to help a fellow hunter find a buck or bull. It used to be that way in hunting but not any more. It hasn't been that way in a very long time. We as hunters, are our own worst enemy when it comes to promoting the sport of hunting. It has become impossible for people to hunt together as a family anymore. I haven't got the balls to start a new company in the hunting industry right now. A friend of mine that has made millions as an entrepenuer in starting several businesses told me that unless you have a new invention with some serious cash backing, the failure rate of new hunting businesses is right at 80%. Bad odds in anybodies book.

On the other hand, I have made lifelong friends while hunting. I consider all of them people that I would help in an instant in any situation, not just hunting. I saddens me to think that this may someday be only something we talk about in the past tense.


It's always an adventure!!!

 

[hossblur]

Founder, I was one of the guys who pushed you to create a Youth section. The shrinking resource is OUR fault. In the competition to be the "alpha male" and hunting for inches TOO MANY of us left the young ones at home because they couldn't keep up, can't sit still, etc. They can come when they are 10, or 12. By then its TOO DAMN LATE. Thanks to the DWR, $FW, and the trophy men, we gave up the heritage and tradition that hunting was(yeah I know we had to cut tags to get to the huge number of deer we have today). I watch the shows, they have special "youth" shows. WTF??? If I go, my son goes, been that way since he was 4. His little brother(turns 4 in Dec.) starts this year. Inches DON'T MATTER. These two having fun does. The "youth" have become an after thought. "I will bring him up next weekend, I don't want to ruin opening day having a loud, slow, kid with me".

Second, its funny to me that we have to spend so much on gear. Sitka is good gear, but it costs a ton because they pay so much to have it seen on the shows and magazines. Like an earlier poster said, buy quality. My 25 year old a- bolt and vari xii 06' kill everything I hit. Yeti coolers? An extra block of ice is a ton cheaper. I know that Al Gores global warming has increased temps, but how did grandpa get buy without a yeti?

I spend money every year on gear, FOR MY KIDS. My son wears rocky boots. He wears top quality coats, top quality gear. My Kings Camo gear I got on clearance 10 years ago still works for me, but my young one is warm and dry, thats where my money goes.

Yeti, sitka, et al, can charge 500% more than what there gear is worth because someone will buy it so that can rock that LOGO. Same reason FORD, CHEV, DODGE, can charge what they do for crewcab diesels, STATUS.

We were studying for hunters safety the other day and we were in my gun cabinet showing different kinds of actions. I pulled out dads .303 Brittish. My son of course was excited because if looked like a gun on Medal of Honor. He didn't believe me when I told him that one gun, open sights, CoreLokt bullets, has killed more deer(big) than all the guys in our camp combined. Dad paid $25 for it, had the stock cut back, and it kills. My son couldn't fathom how a old gun, no scope, no magnum, no custom bullet could do that. The resource that is shrinking is OUR FAULT, not a lack of animals, its a lack of tradition and heritage that keeps our kids coming back year after year regardless of "inches". The industry that sales fantasy and the guys who buy it have led to expectations that aren't real or achievable. If you spend all your time in the strip club and porn sites, of course you can't find a "good woman". Hunting for hundreds of years was about tradition, heritage, experience, and food. Now if its not 30 inches or 350, your less of a male. Our pipedreams are shrinking the resource and sport, and the industry mirror what is happening. If hunting for fun,food, and family were the major push, the industry would respond with products that supported that. Common buisness sense, why sell 50 coolers with a $10 profit, when one yeti has a $100 profit?

Long post to say simply, WE DO IT TO OURSELVES!!


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"

 

[AWHOLELOTTABULL]

Good post Hoss! Spot on.


It's always an adventure!!!

 

[DeerMadness]

You are right Greg- Idaho added 10 & 11 y.o. Hunters this year and gave many tags out to ineligible hunters. What a joke ! Now the Dad's can shoot more animals...

 

[elkun]

so every body hates yeti?? I have one and I have to say their not worth the money to the average hunter, save money all the way around, learn to drink warm beer!!!?

 

[stoney]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-13-14 AT 05:20AM (MST)[p]Brian,

As a long time outfitter here in the Gila region of NM and AZ I have seen a lot of change. The good old days of drawing good quality elk units every year are gone. In this part of the world demand for elk licenses is extremely great part due in the fact that big trophy bulls are a very hot item, but mainly our elk herds in both NM and AZ have grown tremendously since the late 80's, and at the same time the demand to hunt them is growing exponentially. NM's herd has increased from about 35,000 to 90,000 and although there is a lot of elk hunting opportunity in NM it is becoming more popular every year.

I am not one of your atypical trophy hunter outfitters. A big share of the hunters I take, many would like to kill a big bull but are happy just to get out in the wilderness area and hunt and take a decent bulls. I am fortunate as there are no roads in the wilderness areas I hunt and we go in farther than anyone else and you can still bugel a bull in and we don't do hardly any scouting and few to no trail cameras. The elk herds are fairly consistent in where they run and live and the herd is growing.

With that said buy the best equipment you can afford and buy it where you can as your pocket book will allow. I see our industry as growing here in this part of the world due to good game management by our respective Game Dept.'s and from what I see on a daily basis there is a bright outlook for the hunting world. Involving our youth is one of the keys and I am very fortunate to help many youths every year. This year I will be helping the young lady whom drew the Desert Bighorn sheep ram tag in the Fra Cristobal's on the Turner Ranch. I helped a young man from SC get his turkey slam this spring by taking a good Merriam's gobbler. He is a cancer survivor whom I helped when he was 18 take a AZ Hunt of a Lifetime 330 bull in the Blue Range Wilderness of AZ. What a great young man and what a miraculous comeback to defeat his brain cancer. I am getting no monetary return from these hunts but the satisfaction and pride and the absolute joy of helping these young people is worth more than anything.

My own children and grand children are all hunters and I get a special treat this year as my 23 yr. old grandson whom killed a 300 class bull in the Gila Wilderness when he was 12, in the Canyon From Hell, will finally get his dream to hunt trophy antelope on my friends ranch south of Tucumcari, NM this fall.

Brian I personally think the future for hunting is very bright and am optimistic that if a person has the dream, the desire and the get up and go can achieve success in most any endeavor of the hunting industry.

 

[Trammer]

Brian, there is always more room for more Guides and Outfitters in every unit. In fact guiding and Outfitting should be controlled by a free and unregulated market everywhere. Hunters dont need to be told who can assist them and under what circumstances on their hunt.

Why did government want to get into regulating guiding and Outfitting in the first place? Its not brain surgery and unethical or poor performing guides and Outfitters would be eliminated in a free market anyway.Scofflaw hunters and Outfitters would still be busted for wrongdoing. All State and Federal laws regulating guiding and Outfitting are completely unnecessary. These laws dont seem to do anything for wildlife or hunters and I think harm both. The only result I can see from them is in the creation of imaginary jobs for government busybodys

This also points to the general incongruity that is the source of most of our troubles here in North America: The overgrowth in Conservation Law has occurred since the North American Model for Wildlife Conservation reached its pinnacle some 50 years ago. Most everything, regulation wise, especially Administrative Law that has come our way since then is junk.Bad Law is destroying hunting.

 

[alsatian]

I'm not sure all game animals are declining in numbers. White tailed deer? Turkey? Elk in Colorado?

I think the more significant restriction is the numbers of hunters. I do think the number of hunters is declining over the long haul. Older hunters are retiring and are not being replaced by new, young hunters. Older hunters may have grown up with a rural hunting tradition; the on-going migration of people from rural areas to cities in suburbs means that fewer people get into hunting because of the rural hunting tradition. Young people in cities don't know where to hunt. They have many alternative entertainment options. They may be predisposed to fear or be intimidated by wild/semi-wild hunting areas.

Speaking for myself, I am much less inclined to buy a bunch of gadgets related to hunting anymore. I have my gear, and more gear doesn't make me a better hunter. I wear M-51 army surplus wool trousers, a Pendleton wool shirt, a Filson heavy wool vest, a Cabela's heavy parka, Meindl Perfekt Hunter boots, my hunter orange, and that's about it. I have some Nikon Monarch Binoculars and a cheap Etrex GPS that I didn't even have to use this year -- other than settling a question about the altitude of our tent at elk camp. I don't need a range finder. I don't need a more deluxe GPS with mapping capability. I don't need different camouflage to match the season. I've taken elk 3 out of the last 4 years I have hunted elk (2013 saw 14" of snow drop two days before the season opener -- my partner and I saw 30 elk about three miles away but couldn't get to them because of the snow). The hunting isn't about buying the gadgets for me. Now, if someone was selling an affordable robot that would pack my elk out 3 miles for me . . . I might be interested. I haven't seen that product so far, however.

 

[cabinfever]

According to these stats below, I'd say there is plenty of money to be made.If your going to have an online hunting store, it better be cutting edge with lots of stuff to choose from with exceptional customer service and a stellar return policy.

$22.9 Billion+ - Hunting expenditures
1 million ? Near the number of jobs as a result of the Hunting Industry
$2,000 ? Amount per hunter spent on hunting each year
$10.7 Billion ? Hunting equipment expenditures
12.5 million - People 16 years old and older enjoyed hunting a variety of animals within the United States

 

[Buckdownwind]

BRIAN SEE PRIVATE EMAIL.
GREG