WOLF WAR meeting

B

BLT

Active Member
Messages
128
Would like to inform people of MM about the meeting last night at the Mowers home. Sportman need to be aware of the magnitude of this wolf problem, When you see what is happening in these western states it is shocking how out of control the population of wolves is getting.Elk heards in places of montana, wyo, and idaho are dwindling to nothing, the moose herd around jacksonhole is down to only a few animals, I have friends and clients that live in big piney and pinedale wyo who will tell you that the wolves in these areas have no fear of man and are having there way with elk on the winter feed grounds, another outfitter friend told about a band of bighorn sheep that winter high in the windriver mountains that were all killed by wolves this winter.This problem will not go away unless ALL sportsman unite together and win this war Bill HR6028. It was a impressive crowd at the meeting Represenitives from all western states, both REP and DEM. It goes to show that it is not about which party you represent but that all sportsman need to jump on the wagon together and DELIST WOLVES.
There is a web site http://biggameforever.org that everyone needs to check out to see what you can do to take part in this issue. SFW,MDF,RMEF have all come together to fight this it is a impressive team of people, Ryan Benson is the national director behind BIGGAME FOREVER. Very sharp guy.
I can tell you that it is going tocome down to who wins the vote, We as sportsmans have never seen such a more urgent issue in wildlife consevation.I would like to say thanks to Tom Mower for hosting the meeting and thanks to Miles Morretti, Don Peay,Bill christensen, Ryan Benson and all others involved for having the wit and balls to take on this issue,As just a every day sportsman I did not realize how big of a issue this is until the meeting last night.
So for all who read this post get involved and tell all of your hunting friends to vote on the wolf delisting......Paul Pennie
 
Well put Paul, I was also at the meeting. This is time for Sportsman to be heard, united and finish this fight. Yes, it's going to take money, I was very pleased to see many of the individuals that purchase conservation permits that we "average sportsman" complain about day in and day out supporting this cause. I personally can't give the amount of $$ I'd like too put I can give my time, work to have fellow sportsman sign up at big game forever.

Get everyone involved you can; we are in a political fight to retain our hunting heritage.
 
My take on the meeting:

The meeting at the Mower Residence was well attended, fun, but most importantly informative and filled with Action Plans.

Agenda Highlights:
-Tom Mower spoke, and welcomed us.
-Senator Hatch expressed support for HB, and SB to return Game Management to States
-Congressman Matheson expressed support for HB, and SB to return Game Management to States
-Mike Less US Senate candidate, gave a passion filled speech on State rights, very good job.
-Don Peay gave presentation, and expressed the need for money to fight the fight and an update on the upcoming votes.


Here is what I took away.

1: Get involved in the fight: The fight for States rights to control big game, and to maintain our hunting heritage.
2: The risk of loosing our big game and hunting is real, and moving fast.
3: All Sportsman's groups are united in the fight and it will take them all.

There is good information available at:

BigGameForever.org

Get signed up! Get involved! Speak up.
Make sure you understand what is at risk. We are not just talking about loosing big game, we are talking about loosing the opportunity to hunt, and control our States.
 
+1,
I was struck by how critical it is for every HUNTER to join in the fight. If you post here, but are willing to stand on the sideline of this battle, then you might as well be an anti-hunter. They have money and political power behind them now, but if we all stand together and offer whatever we can (financial or making calls, or whatever we can) then we will WIN.
Get involved and join Big Game Forever if nothing else!
 
Littlebighorn is spot on; we can make a difference together. In Utah, the Division issued just over 96,000 big game permits in 2010. If each sportsman that was issued a tag donated just $10 that would put $960K into this battle. Not sure how many of us here on MM can put $960K of our own cash into this but if we come together we CAN make an impact and get back/protect what is ours.

Get this out to all your hunting buddies no matter what state they live in. Let's get this done.
 
Here's a CRAZY idea lets have ALL the proceeds from the 2011 Utah convention go to stop the wolves. We have 200 of the BEST tags in the west being given away for nothing in return. Think of the turnout this would bring? We NEED these sportsman organizations to step up and help fight this battle. Russ
 
I don't get it!

Wasn't the bread and butter of big game hunting lost in the 90s? As far as I know that issue still can be addressed.

What is the difference between wolf and other large predators thriving on our big game herds? Fear of humans is about the only thing I can think of.

And do the powers that be intend to harbor a wolf population in Utah in the future?

I know the answer to the last question and its yes. So what are we fighting for? And whats the urgency?

If you tell me its a stepping stone to correcting the problem we implemented in the 90s. Then I could enlist 100s of folks for the cause. But that's not the case.
 
Yes it's going to take sacrifices from all sportsman and sportsman organizations. The past five years the convention has raised millions of $, to help what? None of this $ even went on the ground? Lets band together to generate this $ to delist the wolfs.
 
Deersman,
Let me give you some information:
-The original plan called for 256 Wolves in Idaho, we are now up to over 1500.
-The Lolo Elk herd in Idaho is virtually gone.
-The Yellowstone herd is down to 6500 Elk, from 20k plus
-Moose in Jackson Hole are down from 1200 to 200.

The wolf introduction plan has succeeded, BUT anti hunting groups are holding up the management of Wolves by States, calling them still endangered...EVEN THOUGH THERE ARE 10 TIMES MORE THAN THE PLAN CALLED FOR.

They are now saying: "Look how well the wolves do their jobs, we do not need hunting"

This effort is to return power to the states allowing them to manage the game in their states....and getting wolf numbers back to the targets.

Listen. we don't get this done there will be no hunting. We have to get these bills passed and get the states managing OUR GAME.

So it is urgent!

Hope that helps.
 
Deersman

I think the big difference between other large predators and the wolf is we actually have control of managing the others. This isn't a question about having wolves in Utah or any other state. They are here and won't go away. I think the point is if we don't have a sense of urgency to get them permenantely delisted we won't have to worry about fixing the 90's because the herds will be desimated much like areas of Montana, Idaho and Wyoming.

We will end up camping in the fall with nothing to look at but the leaves changing colors.
 
We have control of cougar and bear. Yet we manage them to maximum capacity. Not only that we manage them for trophy status.

What makes you think delisting is going to create an open season on wolf? Rather the DWR will manage them for maximum capacity and trophy status as well.
 
Who's to say the elk herd losses in Idaho and Montana haven't been due to human encroachment and habitat loss. That's what happened to Utah's deer right.
 
We have to get them delisted to even have a chance at managing them.

Then we need to push for getting the wolf numbers down to the original plan.

Doing nothing and giving up is not an option. There is an urgent need!

Speak up! Get involved.
 
I can hear it now...

We need these additional tags to fight the wolf. Who doesn't want to protect our hunting rights? In the past we have raised millions of dollars through convention/conservation tags and we need more tags to raise more money. This time we are going to fight the wolf. All the proceeds from these tags will go directly to fight the wolf issue. Just trust me.

I predicted in a previous thread that this would turn to a money issue and I am now betting tags will be proposed as a way to generate the money. Any takers?

Now before people jump all over me I do believe all of need to help fight the anti-hunting/ pro wolf people. I do believe this is a very real threat to hunting. I have done my part through RMEF. I would simply suggest each person choose their spokesperson very carefully.
 
Been to the meetings for several years now!
I can tell you this!

The Wolf best fear the TARDS!
And I don't give a damn what kinda Laws they have passed!

You can't reason with these JOKERS!
So I'm a thinking:Shoot,Shovel & STFU & Shoot again when needed!
There are places for Wolves in this world,TARDville ain't one of them without a big conflict!

Remember:TARDS don't shoot rubber bullets,so you'd best inform the wolves!

God is Great!
Life is Good!
And People are Crazy!
I love not acting my age,
Damn I love my NASCAR race,
And Hell yes I love my Truck!
 
I signed the petition and donated as well. I also posted a link to the site on a couple other sites I visit as well as my FB page and encouraged others to sign and donate. I encourage everybody to do the same.
 
The time to fight the wolves is now. The bill that is there could be introduced before the end of the year. If this bill is passed we win. If it does not pass we loose. This is like another Prop 5 fight. Those behind pushing this bill through is RMEF, MDF, SFW, SCI, The Sheep Foundation, NRA, as well as the Cattlemen association and the Sheep men. I would even bet the Turkey Foundation is getting involved. It is not something to argue about but something for every hunter to be involved in. My feeling is that you are either involved in fighting the wolf or you are on the animal rights side. They want wolves in every state. They want hunting to stop. We are fighting for the right to continue to hunt. Montana, Idaho and Wyoming has already found out what the wolves can do. Hunts canceled because of the wolves. At present rate of growth if nothing is done then the wolves will be killing 80 thousand elk a year by 2015. This is nothing to be trying to slam someone over. The fight is real and started. If you are mad at SFW and Don Peay that is up to you. This is a fight for all sportsmen. The fight against the wolves is real and if we loose it hunting is done. Now is the time for all hunters to come together and fight this war.
 
"Who's to say the elk herd losses in Idaho and Montana haven't been due to human encroachment and habitat loss. That's what happened to Utah's deer right."

Deersman, don't try that garbage on this site. Take it back to the kidnergarden class and your pro wolf friends. We know better.

Eel
 
Here is a good idea shoot the fu#$en thing's when you see them! Instead of trying to raise a bunch of money to have some dumb a$$ tell the d.w.r. how many tags to give. Is this money going to go out hunting to get rid of them or is every body out hunting with a few bullets going to get the job done? I will stay with my gun and my bullet!!! I'm done giving S.F.W. a bunch of money just to see there big shot's go hunt all the big hunt's they knew this was comming for a long time and now they want to try and do something about it what a bunch of bull $hit.
 
>Who's to say the elk herd
>losses in Idaho and Montana
>haven't been due to human
>encroachment and habitat loss. That's
>what happened to Utah's deer
>right.


This is a foolish statement to say the least. B & M'ing about the decisions made in the 90's is useless in the face of one of the greatest big game travesties ever taking place right now. If you live in Utah and Colorado, you had better hang on to your jock because it is just a matter of time before the wolf establishbes a permenant foothold there. While elk is their primary prey, we have also witnessed seconary casualties as well (deer, moose, and bighorn)and believe it or not, antelope and black bear(usually dug out of their dens) are also being killed by wolves.
 
>Who's to say the elk herd
>losses in Idaho and Montana
>haven't been due to human
>encroachment and habitat loss. That's
>what happened to Utah's deer
>right.


Wait, you are one of those guys that believe we really didn't go to the moon huh?

This is real, it's happening.

Now go educate yourself and help out.

Respectfully Tagalong.
 
Hey while you all are running around like the world is coming to an end. The cougar is already established and decimated the deer herds in the west. And when we ask what happened to the deer the majority will tell you some BS like human encroachment drought and habitat loss. Despite the fact that a LE cougar system is the leading cause for the deer decline. Surprise the cougar is a predator just like the wolf. And in Utah they eat 100,000 deer per yr. And yes we have seen deer herd declines by more than 80% off of historical highs. And for those who see this as the biggest thing to ever happen in hunting. We lost more than a million deer in Utah to predators then 200,000 deer hunting opportunities in the 90s. That was the biggest loss we will ever see.

I want one of you wolf fighters to tell me you believe the DWR wont harbor a population of wolf in Utah with or without delisting. Thinking they will have a shoot on sight policy is absolutely foolish.

And you better believe we are being (hunters) replaced. But it didn't start here with wolf. The fight was lost with the banning of poison. Then the adoption of a LE hunt for predators to increase there population. And the same will be true for wolf. I'm sorry it took so many of you until 2010 to figure this out but you all are way to late. Better to save your donation money for a CWMU tag someday. Since those guy wont tolerate a healthy predator population wolf or anything else feasting on there bread and butter.
 
Deerman,
I've come to respect your passion for mule deer, so very glad your committed and focused. I have no doubt that you want to do all you can for deer, I appreciate that, I and many others share your passion and your desire to put mule deer back on their feet, healthy viable herds, able to produce beyond their natural mortality issues so we can continue to hunt this magnificent animal. Furthermore I completely understand your desire to focus as much time, energy, intellect and resources to that end, personally and you expect the same from all others including the State and Federal Agencies. I want the same and I too have hundreds of friends, neighbors and acquaintances who believe the same way you do. Let me offer this observation, I believe are efforts are being made to help our deer. It's been a very long and difficult battle, we've lost nearly every fight we've had trying to save our mule deer. In far too many case we've fought against the vary individuals, organizations and agencies that should have been our heros rather than our adversaries. I can't promise you or anyone else how the fight for healthy mule deer herds is going to end, but I can promise this, it won't be for lack of effort if we completely lose our deer.

Unfortunately many sportsmen see you and I in the same light as you seem to see those involved in the fight over control of wolves in the lower 48. They believe you and I are over-reacting, claim we think the sky is falling, they think we are confused about the causes and the solutions and are demanding time, energy and resources to fix something that isn't broke. You and I believe they are wrong.

I want very much for you to know that there are many of us that feel your pain. However please let me offer my perspective. This issue with wolf management is real, and it's a bonified son of a #####, in the truest sense of the term. At the same time we are fighting for mule deer we have got to get control of wolf management. There are some issues such a preserving the right to bear arms, the right to free speech, etc. that supersede or transcend other important needs and issues.

Because I believe the wolf issue is an effective and deadly tool with which our mortal enemies (so far as hunting, fishing and the outdoor life style are concerned) have used and continue to use, it has got to be stopped, and stopped right now. If it is not, fighting for mule deer will be a mute point. There is absolutely no doubt wolves will, in mind boggling efficiency, wipe out all of our big game herds, including mule deer. If cougar and coyotes are good at killing deer, wolves are fantastic. A cougar has a kitten or two a year, in a few cases triplets, a wolf usually has a litter of 5 or 6 with document cases where litter exceed 14. With an adequate prey base, wolf populations explode exponentially in a very few years. Their only predators are themselves, rarely bears and humans. Wolves, as compared to cougars and bears hunt in social packs and are literally big game killing machines. Especially against big game that has never learned to protect itself (for the last 100 generations) against such an effective predator. The multiplier effect of low predation coupled with 5-6 pups a year (or more) propels a population explosions beyond our wildest dreams.

For a fact, the wolf is going through our big game herds in Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming faster than a swbuckmaster's broadhead clears a Wasatch Front muley liver. Wolves are moving out in every direction including into Utah, they must be stopped and stopped right now. Wolves are already dying off in Yellowstone due to over-population and over predation. Wolf packs are moving and they are deadly.

The folks fighting for State management of wolves need you. They need your energy, you reasoning power, your horse-sense, and your influence. They need you to bring your many friends and those that trust you and your judgement to this fight. This war with wolves needs people like you, and bearman, and swbuckmaster, and Hawkeye and Fishon and Be-Bop, and Stinky and SweetPea, etc., etc. If this war over wolf management is lost, it's over. Hunting big game will end for all intensive purposes. That is not an over reaction, non is it an over statement. It is what the gun control people want, what the PETA people want and people worse than them want.

If you don't trust SFW, donate your time and money to the MDF, or RMEF. Get in the fight somewhere. The Utah Bowman's Associated donated $2000 of hard earned money to the war chest this week. (I don't think these folks have a tremendous fondness for SFW but they get it!) We need every sportsmen and women in this fight because loosing is absolutely unacceptable.

We can still fight for our mule deer herds and win the wolf war as well. I promise the mule deer fight is alive and well.

I would ask, yes, beg you, my friend in the cause for healthy mule deer, if you can't see your way clear to aggressively support the fight to win the States rights to manage wolves, at the very least could I ask that you not fight against our efforts. Especially on these public forums. You're too good at it and we've got all we can handle with the real enemy, so far as the wolf issue is concerned.

As I said earlier, I respect and appreciate you and your strength, I hope you will join our ranks because we need you!!

DC
 
I'm hesitant to donate to a cause with SFW behind the wheel. Do we have any assurance that a good portion of our money will actually go to fighting wolves, and not some other project? What is the overhead?
 
Donate to biggameforever.com all your money will go to fight the wolf war it is its soul purpose.
Yes there will be alot of overhead costs this war is going to be fought in Washington DC alot of money has already been spent but I beleive it is peanuts to what will be needed. Just thank your hunting license there are some people from all over this country with money who love hunting as much as we do. The bills before the senate and congress are simple to the point. If you can't donate or are to worried about SFW then get on your phone call your congressman and senators and let them know this needs to pass. At this time Barnes Bulletts are the only bullet manufacturer to step up for this fight. Give them your business and let others know you expect their support.
SFW montana hammered their 2 senators (who effectivly killed this bill from passing 2 weeks ago) and have givin them an attitude adjustment. They had an attitude similar to some hunters who only worry about there backyard. The anti's dont worry about how much money or who's hands it goes thru they have a clear shot at ending hunting in the west with the big bad wolf. They are making the most of it. The way the ESA is being interpreted by the courts all it will take is one wolf away from the main populations or a forest with game in it and they can never be delisted.
If you are more worried about cougars where were you at the cougar RACs 2 months ago? You could have made a difference I know I did.
Dave
 
Simply amazing! This post could not even make it to 10 before someone starts shooting at SFW.

I also attended the meeting in Springville at the Mower's residence.

This battle is real and is for ALL of the marbles. Winner takes ALL.

Don't give your money to SFW that isn't what is being asked of you. It costs nothing, nada, zilch to join Big Game Forever. It costs only your time to write an email or make a phone call to your US Congressmen.

It isn't about wolves either. This is about State's being able to manage the wildlife resources within their borders. I know first hand the difficulty that Wyoming is experiencing due to their desires to manage wolves on their terms. Bottom line, Wyoming's plan may not be politically correct but it scientifically sound and biologically defensible; yet, the USFWS refuses to help. Why? Because they have been told by their legal council (that's right, they cannot select their attorney) that the Department of Justice isn't about justice, it's about politics.

If you want your state to be able to manage the wildlife resources within your borders than you should be engaged in this fight. This is no different than the NRA leading the fight to protect our 2nd amendment rights. Wyoming has produced an acceptable plan only to see the Department of Justice refuse to defend it. That is why Wyoming is now in court trying to obtain Justice for their wolf management plan.

As simple as I can make it for you; would you rather maintain the current system of wildlife management based upon individual state rights or see the federal government take over wildlife management efforts? That is what this fight is about. Do you think they will side with maintaining and protecting your hunting heritage? I know they will not fight for it, as I have seen them abandon Wyoming on the front lines of this battle.

Get involved or risk losing your hunting heritage!

Bob Wharff
aka) SMOKESTICK
 
If you want to fight the wolf problem, send your money to the organization who is leading the legal fight - Safari Club International.
 
SMOKESTICK:

I have a simple question...Is SFW a parent group for the biggameforever.org? Is Don Peay a major player/one of the heads of this group? Why do you act shocked when people have questions? Some of us are just trying to make an informed decision on who they support. On a side note, it does cost money to join biggameforeever.org. Sending the letter or signing their petition does not make you a member just a supporter. Anybody can and should be sending letters to their congressmen/women and their senators to voice their concerns over the wolves

I believe that not too long ago you were telling everybody on MM that Idaho and Montana were responsible for the Wyoming's wolf issue. (I am paraphrasing an entire thread). Now this is not about the wolf but about state's rights. If I have you mixed up with somebody else I will apologize now before you get all ruffled but I think it was you who was criticizing the Montana and Idaho plans and blaming their plans for the Wyoming wolf hunting ban.

I hope that all hunters rally behind one of the groups fighting the wolf. Be it RMEF, MDF, SFW, whomever they choose. The idea that you are either an anti-hunter or a supporter of biggameforeever.org is laughable.

So that it is very clear where I stand, I will not support SFW. I believe SFW, on numerous occasions, has taken or tried to take opportunity from the average Joe and therefore I will not stand and be counted with them. I will however, fight in every way I can to stop the spread of the wolves throughout the West.
 
Utah400Elk,

Here is the quote to which you make reference; "Others, including Bob Wharff, executive director of the Wyoming chapter of Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife, argue that individual states should be given the responsibility of managing wildlife within their borders. Wharff, however, does not believe this will be the outcome of this lawsuit.

?It's a tragedy that Idaho and Montana will lose the opportunity to manage the wildlife as they see fit,? he said. ?But in part, it's their fault for being so critical of Wyoming?s management plan. As a whole, we all lose when we have a species listed when that listing isn't warranted.?

This quote is from an article entitled "Judge doubts wolf split" and was published in the Jackson Hole News and Guide on June 16, 2010.

I have never spoken against either Idaho or Montana's wolf management plan but I have heard several Idaho & Montana elected officials and state wildlife managers complaining about Wyoming's reluctance to compromise and obligate the entire state to live with wolves. I have never wished any ill on any other state, all I have fought for is Wyoming's right to manage wolves as we see fit in my state. Wyoming understands its obligation to maintain at least a minimum number of wolves as well as minimal number of breeding pairs. Wyoming's plan does that. The experts all reviewed and approved the plans.

You are correct that membership of Big Game Forever costs $10.00 annually. That is less than .03 cents a day to win this war. I don't know all of the players that are in Big Game Forever but I do know that this issue is much bigger than any individual state. As I stated in my reply, this one is for all of the marbles. Hate SFW for whatever reason you or anyone else wants but for hell sake realize the consequence of in action on everyone's part.

I have spent considerable amount of time with Ryan Benson, Director of Big Game Forever, and believe in his abilities to get this done. He and I went to Wisconsin and attended the National Trappers Association event. It was amazing to me to see first hand that the stories being told in the Upper mid-west were identical to those I am hearing out west. This issue is not simply an isolated event it is a concerted effort to alter the North American Model of Wildlife Management. This model is the envy of the World. If Sportsmen do not rally behind this effort and we lose this battle, it won't matter what any of us think anymore because the federal government will not listen to your concerns, nor mine, or anyone else.
 
SMOKESTICK:

You previously said "Yes, I really do think, in part Idaho & Montana should share some of the blame if they are re-listed because Wyoming's plan was rejected." So, call it what you will but when you said "I have never spoken against either Idaho or Montana's wolf management plan." I just don't see it. If I am wrong I am sorry. That is my take on that.

After my last post I looked more closely at biggameforever.org and if you look at the "about us" link on the upper left you are directed to a page that has the following information:

SFW is the founding partner.

and Don Peay is one of the two founders.

So as the Wyoming state SFW president you don't know that SFW is the founding partner and you don't know that the SFW founder (Don Peay) is one of the two founders? You have spent "considerable time with Ryan Benson" but don't know that Don Peay is the other founder? Really?

You also said "Hate SFW for whatever reason you or anyone else wants but for hell sake realize the consequence of in action on everyone's part" Is it inaction if I don't support Don Peay or SFW? I have given my financial support to RMEF. Is that inaction. According to this post all the conservation groups are standing together so my support to RMEF is support? Or does it only count if it's throught the new group?

Once again...everyhunter should do all they can to help fight the wolves. We mnay disagree about the best way fight but we shoudl all be fighting.
 
What exactly has biggameforever done for the wolf fight?

Since 2003, SCI has participated in five cases involving the U.S. FWS?s efforts to (1) downlist and delist gray wolves in the western Great Lakes and Northern Rocky Mountains, and (2) allow greater state management of depredating wolves while the wolf remains on the Endangered Species list. SCI is still actively pursuing two of these cases. This includes being a named appealant in the Molloy case. http://helenair.com/news/article_c32ad0d6-cde8-11df-8661-001cc4c002e0.html

"The state Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks and federal Department of Justice joined Idaho, the Idaho and Montana Farm Bureau federations, and the Mountain States Legal Foundation in asking the court to revisit Judge Donald Molloy?s ruling. In Molloy?s opinion, gray wolves can't be considered a recovered species in Idaho and Montana while remaining listed as endangered in Wyoming. Also joining the appeal Friday were the National Rifle Association of America and Safari Club International."

SCI is fighting the wolf war while BGF is collecting money. You want to end wolves, send your money to SCI.

http://www.scifirstforhunters.org/Join/
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-20-10 AT 11:35AM (MST)[p]Geez Lumpy2, Your post was rather disarming. Though I cant help feeling a bit patronized.

I know it's not what anyone wants to hear. But its is real and must be acknowledged. And if we all could get on the same page and wake up to the true reality facing us. Then all we are pawns of the powers that be. And the only ones to profit from this fight will be so called conservation groups and lawyers. And many don't realize wolf advocates are facing a win win situation.

It is more a question of how are we going to manage predators.

It wont matter if states have control of wolf management if states are willing to tolerate wolf populations. I cant speak for any other state other than Utah. Here in Utah we manage predators to maximum capacity. And its widely accepted. I believe that in the case of the wolf they too will be managed to maximum capacity. And just like the the cougar a handful of cougar hunters will trump the needs of 100,000s big game hunters. And the Pied Piper Don Peay wont save you. Ever herd Don say anything on the cougar deer deal. But you will hear him talk all about $100,000s on habitat.

You see its a bigger picture deal its how do we manage predators. And there is no indication what so ever that we will replace predators as the primary tool to keep prey populations from getting too big. I argue lower predator populations and use hunter harvest to prevent overpopulation.

And last let me say I'm not a proponent you wont find a more passionate predator control advocate. This includes wolf as well. And I have done more and am willing to stick my neck out farther than 95% percent of big game hunters in that endeavor.


Rise and Shine.
 
Unless the US Supreme Court does something, I think the wolf battle is already lost. Folks are talking about getting congress to change the ESA. Good luck. The republicans controlled congress and the presidency for the first six years of last decade and never lifted a finger in order to amend that crappy legislation. Now you have democrats running the show. They'll lose some seats in a few weeks, but I'll bet you'd need a republican majority to get wolves exempted from the act. And who knows what'll happen if it ends up on Bama's desk. If a bunch of nut hugging left wingers throw a pile of money his way, he'll do whatever they tell him. Regarding the US Supreme Court, I'll bet we're still 10 years away from them ever rendering a decision. By then, folks will be pushing for elk in the northern Rockies to be listed under the ESA due to none being left...
 
>Unless the US Supreme Court does
>something, I think the wolf
>battle is already lost.
>Folks are talking about getting
>congress to change the ESA.
> Good luck. The
>republicans controlled congress and the
>presidency for the first six
>years of last decade and
>never lifted a finger in
>order to amend that crappy
>legislation. Now you have
>democrats running the show.
>They'll lose some seats in
>a few weeks, but I'll
>bet you'd need a republican
>majority to get wolves exempted
>from the act. And
>who knows what'll happen if
>it ends up on Bama's
>desk. If a bunch
>of nut hugging left wingers
>throw a pile of money
>his way, he'll do whatever
>they tell him. Regarding
>the US Supreme Court, I'll
>bet we're still 10 years
>away from them ever rendering
>a decision. By then,
>folks will be pushing for
>elk in the northern Rockies
>to be listed under the
>ESA due to none being
>left...


ME TOO, LETS ALL JUST CURL UP IN THE FETAL POSITION AND SUCK OUR THUMBS.
 
Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Feds comply with court order on wolves
October 26th, 2010 @ 11:10am
By Associated Press
BILLINGS, Mont. (AP) -- The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service says it is publishing an official rule putting gray wolves back on the endangered species list in the Northern Rockies.

Tuesday's announcement follows an Aug. 5 federal court order that forced the cancellation of wolf hunts planned in the region this fall.

That order from U.S. District Judge Donald Molloy reversed the government's 2009 decision to lift protections for wolves in Idaho, Montana and parts of Oregon, Utah and Washington.

The Fish and Wildlife rule formalizes Molloy's order administratively.

There are more than 1,700 wolves across the Northern Rockies including Wyoming, where they were never taken off the endangered list. That number increased slightly last year despite hunts in Montana and Idaho.

(Copyright 2010 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

If the elections go as predicted next Tuesday night, there will be substantial momentum for Congress to immediately act and pass HR. 6028 and S. 3919.

These house and senate bills simple say

The Gray Wolf (Canis Lupus) shall not be treated as an endnagred species or threatened species for teh purpose of this Act (ESA).

what that would do, when passed, would give EVERY STATE, the right to manage wolves immediately, as they see fit, without any possibility to litigate. Congress speaks, changes a law, the anti hunters have NO recourse in court.

It is very important we get this legislation passed, becasue teh 1,700 wolves will be 3,000 wolves by calving and fawing season.

If passed, wolves could be managed and reduced prior to the 2011 calving and fawning seasons, and begin the long process of rebuilding herds in many areas of MT, ID, and WY.

It just amazes me that two sportsmen in particular, Ryan Benson of Big Game Forever and myself are working 24/7 on this issue, giving up all our hunts, and yet there are sportsmen on this site, blasting us. Go join PETA and Destroyers of wildlife.

We are moving forward, we can use everyones help to get this done.

i will put up a post after election night, it might have some very favorable results for sportsmen on this issue, if thet trends and individual races continue as they are today, just 5 days out.

if you want to help on this issue, please go to www.biggameforever.org

Don
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Don:

If I donate to RMEF and give them support am I not also helping to fight the wolves? Donate to you/join biggameforever or go join PETA. You are a bigger joke than I gave you credit for. Why not take YOUR expo proceeds and money and use it to fight the wolves. If you have been doing such a great job through SFW, than why the need for a new group with you as a founder to fight the wolves. I almost forgot, just for fun, how about the things promised about the expo. I am going to guess that you have been so busy fighting the wolves you have not had time. Whatever you do people, don't look at the guy behind the curtain. Go back under the rock you climbed out from.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

LAST EDITED ON Oct-28-10 AT 12:22PM (MST)[p]Utah400,
Are you serious, that's your reply. I can't understand how someone could be so ignorant to say that the time and effort Don has put into the Wolf problem is anything but good thing. How can we as hunters not appreciated the effort he has put into the wolves, even if you don't like anything else about him.

Let's argue about other issues we all have different opinions about deer and elk management but I don't understand how getting a bill threw Washington can be anything but good. There are a lot of people that have put a lot of effort into this and one of those people is Don. I for one am very grateful for his effort in this fight.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Don your silence on serious deer management over the last 20 yrs has done more for PETA'a agenda than any of us could ever do.

Congrats Don you have presided over the largest decline of hunter opportunity we have ever seen. Now we stand on the threshold of statewide LE deer hunting in Utah. And truth be known you are the benefactor behind going there.

And I have zero confidence you intend to keep wolf in check once states do gain control. More I see this as an opportunity for you to rub shoulders with federal politicians. And recruit new members and raise money.

You sir are a Wolf in sheep's clothing.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

noluck

That is my reply to Don saying that if we question him we should join PETA. I am glad for everything everybody has done to fight the wolves. That includes what Don has done. There is no question that Don is NOW involved in the fight against the wolves.

The way I read Don's reply was that if a person does not agree with Don than they are basically an anti-hunter (go join PETA). It looks as if Don has moved on from his SFW title to the actual definition of hunting. If I question anything Don does I am now an anti-hunter. That is the joke. If you are too ignorant to see the problem with this than I can't help you. Don has done a lot for himself and some would argue that Utah hunting has benefited.

When we all met on the steps of the Utah capitol the deer herd was the battle cry. What has happened in those years? The deer herd is crap and not getting any better. This is NOT Don's fault but every time I turn around Don has his hand out asking for more tags. What are the proceeds of those tags going to? Why not open the books to be reviewed so that pesky question goes away? What is the expo money going to? Where are the items pertaining to the expos that have been promised on several occasions? Don has said SFW is leading the fight in Utah against wolves but then starts another organization to fight the wolves? Why? What about the Utah Wolf plan that Don helped with wherein the plan calls for wolves to be allowed to expand into Utah. So Don helps draft a plan to allow wolves in Utah and then a couple years later asks for money to fight them? Why was Don "ok" with that plan but now calls for money to fight the wolves? I think those are valid questions.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Nearly million acres of habitat has been tore up and replanted, specifically to help mule deer.

Many highways have been fenced, tens of thousands of coyotes have been killed, cougar harvest went from 250 up to 700 for a few years.

It is very disappointing to many, who have worked hard and donated and invested lots of money.

Utah's deer herd, like many other states, has by and large continued to decline.

Here is a question, where would Utah's deer herd be without the million acres of habitat fixed, the highways fenced in places, increased coyote,lion and bear control ?

SFW stepped up and helped fund a $140,000 DWR Deer Survival study, on deer units since Jan. of this year. So far preliminary results show about 80% adult survival and 55% fawn survival. Clearly, to me, coyotes are killing lots of fawns, and that is still a pretty high adult mortality for just one year. Causes of death were not part of the study, even though that was SFW board desire. With this high of mortality, it seems MORE data is going to have to be gathered to find out why, i think a lot of us believe it is NUmber ONE, coytes, then bears and lions.


I meet personally with Pres. Bush and VP Cheney TWICE to get wovles delisted, not to many other people can say that. The Final deal to get it done was cut in Bubba's barbeque in Jackson Wyoming, 4 of us were in the meeting, 1 Fed and three SFW members.

We helped get them delisted TWICE. TWICE, a judge put them back on the list.

SFW spent a lot of money - one of two sportsmen groups in court - SCI and SFW, trying to keep wolves of the list. The SFW Attorney was Mike Lee, now a few days away from Being a US Senator, Lee was at the meeting this post started about.

How many sportsmen can call a meeting, have two US Senators show up, and Congressman to work on our issues - not many. The utah Congressman not at the meeting, will be a Major player in leadership in 5 days in the House if the Repubs. take teh house like everyone predicts. I have worked with Chaffetz for a long time on many issues.

SFW has been in the wolf fight for ten years.

I told everyone ten years ago, get in the fight, it is the biggest train wreck in our history, and that is being validated by many sportsmen, now, who are joining the fight. yet, some still want to cast stones for those fighting 24/7 to finally get this done. Thanks.


So, now to wolves and big Game forever was started because it is a different tax structure - IRS requirements for lobbying Congress. your donations to BGF are not tax deductible, but 100% of the money from BGF can be spent lobbying on this issue.

BGF has ONE mission, get wolves of the list, and as this post started out, TWO US Senators and a Congressman came to a meeting with 300 sportsmen from around the country, and the US Senators said, hell of a job in DC by the guy some of you hate -me, this thing is finally moving.

also, BGF was set up to decrease "competition" among groups, SFW, RMEF, MDF, etc - and after wolf issue is done, BGF goes away, just like the campaing, Utahn's for Wildlife Conservation went away after Prop. 5.

Greatful other groups are helping. 100% of BGF money goes to the wolf effort, you can ask how much of your money to other groups goes to wolf effort.

Bottom line is this, PETA and HSUS and Destroyers of wildlfie will raise tens of millions to keep wolves on the List and let them kill 90% of the wildlife, so none of us can hunt.

This post was started to inform sportsmen that there is a clear path to vicotry HR 6028 and S. 3919.

Get on Board if you care to hunt in the future, there are tens of thousands of hunters in ID, MT, WY, MN, WI and other states saying, get ahead of the wolf train, or it will destroy everything We have.

Finally, the Utah wolf plan calls for TWO packs of wolves, and if they get in trouble, they get wacked. The SFW positoin was ZERO WOLVES, teh Board approved two packs. the Director, then Kevin Conway felt if there were two packs the Judge might not put them ont eh list. i disagreed and said, he will put them on the list, no matter what. So, easy to be a monday morning quarter back, i was on record, SFW position NO wolves. WE lost taht one in the wildlife board meeting.

This last spring, I went to the Utah legislature and asked if they would ammend a law, and kill all the wolves in utah until teh USFWS changed their boundary to include all of Utah. The legislature changed the law, wolves were wacked in Utah, then the Judge put them back on teh list in all of the country.


But, right now, the utah wolf plan is invalid, they are Endangered Species in all teh land.

The wolf lovers now fear they are in deep trouble, after the two weeks i spent in Washington and this legislation came out, and now they are scrambling like crazy to try and 'negotiate a deal" google the Jackson news paper and find out, or call the USFWS SErvice Director Dan Ash, who used to work for Defenders of Wildlfie, who called Miles Morretti, asking for a deal.

Ash won't call me, he knows what i would tell him, but Miles told him the same thing, nicely, go pound sand.

After the election on Tuesday night, for those who care, i can spell out what i think will happen on the finish of having Congress Change a law they wrote - the ESA - and how that law can be fixed so states can manage wolves and protect game herds. Unitl that law is changed, wolves can kill everything, and nothing can be done. If someone shoots a wolf, they can go to federal prison.

Not good options, not a good place to be.

So, on this one, it is be part of the problem, or part of the solutoin. Help pass S. 3919 and HR 6028

then we can fight over shooting 5 year old, or 8 year old bulls, or 18 bucks or 25 bucks per 100 does on five units, or 29. Don't win the wolf war, it is all over, it is just a matter of time.

you asked some questions, you got the answers.

Don
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Don:

As I said you are now doing more than your part on the wolf front and for that I thank you. What about your comment that if someone questions you they should join PETA? What about the expo odds and openness that you promised? You are just like a politican, when asked a question you answer parts but not the whole question. Eveytime somebody asks you a question you deflect and talk about how much was spent in Utah. You are very careful not to say SFW spent "x" number of dollars but you say things like "SFW stepped up and helped fund a $140,000 DWR Deer Survival study". The key word is HELPED. Of the $140,000 you brought up on the habitat how much actual money did SFW put forward?

You always seem to deny and make counter acquastions. You say 100% of the money from BGF will go to fight the wolves? Is that a promise like the things you promised with the expo? How much is overhead and how much money are you making? Why not use the money from the expo to help fight the wolves?

Do you really think that the pro wolf people are afraid of you? Don I have asked to meet with you several times and you will not meet with me. Does that mean you are afraid of me? Using your logic you must fear talking with me.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Eric,

Your shooting yourself in the foot. I understand your post. You have some valid points. Everyone needs to fight this issue.

Don,
Thanks for your hard work and fighting for our future. You are a person who will roll up his sleeves and fight. Thanks again.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

All this talk about HR. 6028. IH, and S. 3919 got me to look them up. Just wanted to see them for my self so not to assume the obvious.

It may be to those wanting to be educated on the issue that these are two bills that were introduced within the last few months one by Mr Edwards of Texas (H.R. 6028) in the house of representatives, and the other by Sen Orrin Hatch (S.3919) in the Senate.

Here are the links.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.6028:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:S.3919:

It seems that there are a few that hate the idea of Don being behind BGF. I don't get it really but whatever. What I really feel is that the frustration should be channeled towards the root of the issue. Why did the Wildlife Board (Utah) pass that there should be two wolf herds in Utah??????? It Seems that within the political arena the Wildlife Board has all the say in how Utah's wildlife is managed and every decision that is both proposed and passed comes at the hands of them.

Is there anyone on MM that is on the Wildlife Board?

At the federal level it seems that the only way to sway a decision is to pressure congressman, senators, and throw Billions of dollars towards an enormous legal battle. One that is a necessary evil in this fight to keep our herds, deer, elk, sheep, etc. And our hunting heritage. It is going to take a sustained battle against those on the other side of the fence.

On the state level it would seem that we have a better chance at directing the decisions that are made. However, I don't believe that the Wildlife Board listens to the public and that the RAC's are just a way for them to say we gave the public an opportunity for public opinion. I am not in favor of being a part of the problem so I am carful to cast stones at something I'm not fully educated on.

I have attended many RAC's and Wildlife Boards in the past only to come away frustrated. It seems that the "public" we as hunters are such a minority in support/opposition in the eyes of those managing our wildlife that our voice is brushed under the table and their own agendas are raised to the top and policy is written.

Take the new deer management plan for example. I receive the wild life new email and when I got that and read it explaining that the DWR was asked by the Utah Wildlife Board to focus on increasing the number of buck per 100 does. It also said that "with the board's input, the DWR has identified three options that could increase the number of deer in Utah". As I opened and read each option, the first option was the DWR's preferred option. This is what I read and interpreted as a member of the "public".

Decrease deer hunting permits and increase fees.

What does this have to do with the Wolf battle?

It just seems to me that every issue relating to wildlife is surrounded by politics and that these decisions that get us so fired up that we start blaming each other will never be resolved unless we all become lobbyist and join the fight. All these comments about SFW, Don Peay, BGF and transparency in this thread and many, many others by MM'ers is just stupid. Nothing is going to go your way if you or me or each one of us don't take our desires right to the steps of the capital and debate the sh!t out of our cause.

Don Peay is a good man, but he will never please the masses totally because he has is own agenda's just as we all do. I'd like to see all of us, I mean all of us, all 50 thousand of is hunters or however many there are in Utah show up at the RAC's and Wildlife board's and stand united for what we all complain about on MM.

You don't think that if 50 thousand hunters showed up on Dec 2nd to the wildlife board meeting that the members on that board would be thinking, what the sam hell, is going on here. We need to take our own advice as pertaining to shooting wolfs. SSS we need to shut up and show up and fight this thing and every other issue pertaining to wildlife and how "WE" the public what it managed.

That goes for wolf management as well.

For what ever it is worth, I support RMEF, NRA, FNAWS, SFW, WTF, FULL CURL all of them, but I don't see the founders of anyone of them getting on here and defending and explaining what they are doing to fight the Wolf War except Don Peay!
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

rmef. unitah basin. has and will do whatever don ask on this . we might not see eye to eye on other things. but wihout don. we will lose this fight. and none of us .and that means all of us. can live with that. elkun.......
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

The Democrat Congressman from New Mexico, a state with Two democratic Senators, who received $450,000 in campaign contributions from Destroyers of Wildlfie, LOST last night to a Republican. I know a lot of sportsmen who normally vote Democrat in New Mexico, switched last night and voted Republican, they could see the Destroyer of Wildlfie Agenda.

Conversly, Matheson won last nigh, one of the FEW Democrats to win. Congressman Matheson was a CO-SPONSER and leader in teh House and campaigned on his support of wolf managment.

Animal rights loose, sportsmen win. the First thing DC politicians care about, is if i support issue X, does it get me votes or cost me votes. Last night answered taht question.

Sportsmen win.

It is time to finish this fight, now.

Thanks elkun, lets join like never before and win the wolf wars.

There were two guys in DC getting this bill done, Don Peay and Ryan Benson, with Ted Lyon helping from behind teh scenes.

Last week, Ryan Benson, leader of Big Game Forever, was in Montana going door to door, meeting with top leaders and got key signatures from every major ranching group an dhunting group and that letter was presented to Sen. Tester and Baucus.

There was ONE sportsmen in the United States in a meeting for 45 minutes with Sen. Reid, two Montana Senators, and Five other Sponsors of the wolf delist bill, discussing S. 3919, Don Peay.

100% of the money to www.biggameforever.org goes to win teh wolf war.

Lets get everyone on board and win this fight of our generation and save our hunting heritage and our herds.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

critics are those who ride in and shoot the wounded after the battle is won
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

>critics are those who ride in
>and shoot the wounded after
>the battle is won


BS. I belong to SCI which has spent more money and done more Wolf work than BGF.

No one heard anything about wolves from you until you started BGF about a year ago. This is just your latest marketing scheme.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Brymoore,

BGF is new...marketing scheme? Don't think so, SCI has contributed to fighting this in the courts, yes. BGF is taking it to the house and senate to make real change. As for not hearing anything from Don prior to a year ago; guess you don't listen or just haven't payed attention he's been in this fight much longer than that.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

This whole thread is one big marketing scheme. How many times is Don going to beg for money on here? If BGF work is political, why do they need the money? Payoffs?

Where are the financial statements for SFW? Where are they are for BGF? All this money spent but no reporting.....


I suggest you stop sipping on the cool-aid.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

brymore,

i didn't start this post, other concerned sportsmen did.

SCI has been in the litigation side of this, as stated above.

here are the FACTS, call Orrin Hatch or Jim Matheson or Chet Edwards, or Denny Rebehrg or Jason Chaffetz or Mike Crapo they are the cosponsors of the bill. Ask them who asked to get the legislative solution started and who was in DC in the meetings with Senator Reid, and the rest of the heavy lifting to move the bills forward.

Big game forever - has worked to get the legislative solution in DC. WE started on teh legislative solution back in March of this year when we anticipated Malloy would put them back on the list, then the only option would be to spend 3-5 years in court of appeals in San Francisco, all the while.

So, facts are facts, call the Senators or Legislators listed above and ask them who got the ball rolling, and who was in the two week fight in DC to get it filed with co-sponsors in both chambers.

Just last week, Ryan Benson of Big Game forever traveled to Montana, and SCI MT, RMEF, MDF MT, SFW MT, and Farm Burea MT, CAttleman MT, and Woolgrowers Mt signed teh letter that was delivered to Sen. Tester and Baucus asking them to support S. 3919

Not a marketing scheme, post was started by a concerned sportsmen, my name got brought up, so questions get asked, you get answers.

call the co-sponsors of the bill in the House and Senate, then report to all of us who was in DC getting the bill moving forward.
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

Well, Brymoore, pass that cool aide it over, I'll take another chug.

I like SCI too, been a member myself.

I took you at your word and spent the last two hours searching the internet for SCI's efforts regarding wolves. I'm not the best at internet research but I gave it a good try.

Came up with a reference to a donation SCI made to a group in Minnesota, couldn't find any details, more of a passing comment. Did find a $25,000 dollar donation to a Minnesota organization but there was no detail as to what it was to be used for. Those two could be related , no way to know so far as I could tell.

Did find a news release or three that referred to SCI supporting a Montana group wanting Montana, Idaho and Wyoming to support their groups recommendation on what to do about wolves. The article only mention SCI along with other supporters, such as the following:

http://www.jhnewsandguide.com/article.php?art_id=6592

"Leaders of the hunting groups said they understood their members are upset a lawsuit, which Clark?s group took part in and won, put the federal government back in charge of wolves this year. Presidents of the Boone and Crockett Club, the Mule Deer Foundation, the Pope and Young Club, the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, Safari Club International and Safari Club International Foundation, Wild Sheep Foundation and the Wildlife Management Institute signed off on the editorial."

So then I studied the SCI financials and couldn't find a single reference to funds spent on fighting for or against wolves. Fact is, reviewing SCI financials revealed a lot of interesting recipients but not a single mention of wolves. I would highly recommend everyone review where and how SCI spend their money. I got no quarrel with what they are doing but can't see a lot going into the wolf fight. Help me out, where is there a record of SCI's effort?

http://www.scifirstforhunters.org/content/index.cfm?action=view&Content_ID=165&Parent_Content_ID=109

So if SCI is in fact doing so much to get the wolves in the Rocky Mts under control, as you claim, where would I go to find what it is they are doing, specifically that is?

Maybe it's your turn for a little transparency, show us where SCI is "is leading the legal fight" against wolves. I'm just guessing but I'll bet there are many groups thought out the country who believe THEY are the "real" ones leading the legal fish against wolves.

I can tell you this FOR A FACT, U.S. Senator Orin Hatch, U.S. Congressman Jim Matheson, U.S. Senator Elect Mike Lee support Don Peay and his wolf fight effort, they respect him, they claim he has a great deal of influence in Washington D.C. where the wolf fight is going to be won or lost. These guy's are all telling sportsmen to support Don Peay's wolf war chest.

You actually believe these guys are risking their reputations and political careers on a Don Peay marketing scheme?

You think these big time political operators, from the most powerful country the world has ever known, are going to take a full evening out of the last two weeks of their campaigns to come to some guy's house on a back road in Utah to tell us how much good Don is doing in the fight for wolf management? And half or more of the thepeople in the audience are from outside of Utah.

You think a Don Peay marketing scheme can get two of the most power men in Washington, DC, from opposite sides of the isle, to show up in a room together, to tell a bunch of people who can't cast a vote for them, how great Don Peay is?

You think brilliant business minded people that make a living sorting the real from the bullshit everyday of their lives fly into Utah for a two hour meeting with a guy running a marketing scheme cloaked as a fight against wolves?

How is it that you are some much wiser, so much more perceptive, so much more knowledgeable, and are so much more in touch with the political and judicial system than all of these "cool aide drinkers"?

There's no logic in that my friend. What ever you're drinking ain't cool aide, whatever it is, it's effecting your reasoning ability, when it comes to the wolf issue.

You can say what you will about Don, I'll take his word over folks who post here behind a mask, because they can.

To those interested in saving our big game, give this a try, send some money to SCI and all the rest, they are doing good things for our wildlife, but for hells-sake, login into: http://biggameforever.org/ and join Don's effort too and donate what you can toward this cause, because losing this fight has life changing consequences.

I'll be watching for your evidence brymoore.

DC
 
RE: Just seen on KSL News today.. Oct 26th

DC

Have your tried the same search with BGF or SFW? How much did they spend on wolves? Where are their financials to review?

SFW has never been open with their financials and it appears BGF is following suit. We get a lot of stories of these great meetings with photo ops.

SCI is a named litigant in a wolf lawsuit. You can look at their financials. The specific spending on wolves is not broken out specifically on their audited financials. The funds are held within the $6.7 millions dollars they spent on conservation and government affairs in 2009.

http://www.scifirstforhunters.org/content/index.cfm?action=view&Content_ID=165&Parent_Content_ID=109

I have an email into them for how much they have spent on the wolf issue. I'll let you know if they respond.
 

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