Broad head choice

nvhunter

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LAST EDITED ON May-26-12 AT 06:13AM (MST)[p]I know this has been asked probably a thousand times before but...Trying to help the boy figure out which broad heads are a good choice. Now i realize asking that question is like asking about Ford or Chevy or Dodge.
He has been shooting a bow for a couple of years now, but has never had an archery tag. This year he drew an Antelope archery tag in NV, and may be going on an archery elk hunt in ID.
So my question(s) are...
Fixed blade or expandable?
Which brand do you like?
Which brand do you NOT like?
 
In Idaho, you will be limited to fixed blades only. Mechanicals are not legal here.

I like the muzzy 3 blade, 100 grain personally. I like that they have changable practice blades and changing the blades is very simple. I have yet to destroy one completely. I have damaged a few blades on rocks after a miss or a pass through, but the blades are easy to change. They are also less expensive than most other brands.

Whatever brand you choose, I recommend something with strong construction, sharp blades, and exchangable blades unless you want to sharpen them yourself. Something that has practice blades is important to me because I can shoot the actual broadhead that I'm going to hunt with at targets and be confident that each one is shooting the way it should.

I'm can't tell you any brands I don't like because I've never shot anything else. We've been using these for 3 years now and have no reason to switch.

That ain't a camel toe, that's a moose knuckle!
 
Thoughts on Broadheads

Few subjects generate more debate or customer/brand loyalty then broad heads. Everybody has an opinion on them, so I thought I would post mine. Each different design has its advantages and disadvantages
Disclaimer: Lots of people on this forum have more experience and mechanical expertise than me, so take it for what it's worth

SHARPNESS *
Sharper is better, it's that simple. That being said, sharp enough is good enough, if a head is reasonably sharp it will do the job. The generally accepted standard is if it will shave hair off your arm, it's more than sharp enough. Another ?Sharpness? issue is the ability to get acceptable sharpness on a 60% edge angle like G-5 Montec or Snuffer type heads. The fact is, while you can get them ?Sharp enough?, they can never be made as sharp as traditional, replaceable blade heads that use a 30% or less angle on the blades edge. A 60% edge WILL produce more resistance than a narrower edge.

2,3 OR 4 BLADE
Broadheads kill by severing blood veins (see PREFORMANCE ON GAME) With all due respect to Dr. Ashby, I believe 3 and 4 blade heads have an advantage over 2 blade heads because they produce a three
dimensional wound channel compared to the two dimensional wound channel of a two blade head. This causes the potential to sever veins that a two blade head might slip past without touching. It also leaves larger three dimensional entry and exit holes for better blood trails.

CUT ON CONTACT *
Possibly the most over used or misused term in regards to broad heads. Most people think this divides broad heads into two categories. I believe it's more accurate to divide them into three.

With a true ?Cut on contact? head, the first thing to contact the target is a two dimensional, single pointed sharp edge. Examples would be the old Bear Razor head and the newer Magnus Stinger.

Simi cut on contact would be heads where the first cut is made by a three dimensional sharpened edge like on the Magnus Snuffer or G-5 Montec.

Non cut on contact heads would be represented by heads with pointy or Trocar style tips like Original Muzzys or Slick Tricks.
The advantage of a true cut on contact is it produces less resistance at the initial cut, retaining more of it's energy for penetration. The possible disadvantage is this thin blade might not be as strong, and could possibly bend or roll if serious resistance like a shoulder bone is encountered.

PENATRATION *
Penetration is more important then wound channel (see 2,3 OR 4 BLADE ) The ideal is to fully penetrate both lungs, and leave an exit wound. A massive wound channel that only occurs in one lung still leaves the animal the ability to breath with the other lung. Further more, enough penetration to cause an exit wound will produce more blood on the ground for tracking. The fact is, any reasonable combination can and should produce enough penetration on deer size game. When the quarry is larger animals like elk, the ability to penetrate should be a prime consideration.

MECHINACIAL
By all accounts, modern, well designed mechanical broad heads are reliable and deadly.
Many have larger cutting diameters than is possible with a fixed blade broad head that flies true at high speeds. Still, by design, mechanical broad heads have moving parts, parts that could fail to move properly and at the right time. Another consideration is the weak link. Pivoting blades must pivot on something, and it's usually a tiny pin that might sheer off. Sliding blade designs need something to stop the sliding, once again, usually a very small tab or part that has the potential to break. For now, I have a hard time trusting them, maybe someday.


WEIGHT
The main consideration is picking a weight that matches the spine of your arrow (or an arrow that matches the weight of your broadhead), and produces adequate FOC. Beyond that it doesn't matter. You should be using an arrow that has the weight properties you are looking for.


ENDORSMENTS
The worst possible reason to choose a piece of equipment is because of celebrity endorsements. Lets face it, some people would hunt with a rusty sparkplug on the end of their arrow if they were paid enough.

BLADE ANGLE
Blade angle is worth considering to a point, but don't over do it.

NEW vs. OLD SCHOOL
Over the last ten or fifteen years, new designs that are shorter, with smaller cutting diameters have become popular. Because they have less surface area to be affected by air flow, they tend to be more accurate. Most of these new heads are 1 1/8? or smaller. The term ?field point accurate? is very common now, where twenty years ago, most fixed heads were 1 ?? up to 1 ?? and it was largely assumed that it was impossible to get a broad head to hit the same as a field point. Smaller diameters serve two purposes, the help accuracy and increase penetration. Precision manufacturing techniques produce heads that spine true right out of the package. I'm a big fan of these newer broad heads.

ANADOTAL EVIDANCE
Every different shot on a game animal is different. There are so many possibilities that comparing different broadheads performance within a limited sampling is worthless. In other words, just because someone says he had three quick one shot kills with brand X, but lost a deer with brand Y doesn't mean brand X is any better than brand Y.

PREFORMANCE ON GAME
Broadheads kill by severing blood veins. Blood loss reduces or stops oxygen from getting to the brain and other major organs. Internal bleeding can also fill the lungs with blood, causing the same effect. The more veins a broadhead can cut, the faster death will occur. Larger cutting diameter and/or more cutting surface gives the potential to cut more veins within the wound channel, but also cause more resistance, possibly restricting penetration.
Broad head choice should be made considering the game hunted, and the momentum of your arrow.
Lower poundage bows with less arrow momentum should lean towards cut on contact, smaller cutting diameters and fewer blades to increase penetration. Tougher animals require tougher broad heads.

SHOT PLACMENT
Shot placement and angle is far more important that all of this. The fact is a cheap, dull, bargain basement broad head put through both lungs will be much more effective then the very best broad head in the guts.
 
I have never been a fan of mechanical broadheads personally. For one, I hate the mere thought of there being a mechanical failure on one not opening. I know, I know, the odds are like 1 in a billion right? That said, I like fixed head for sure.

Also, I have used 6 or 7 different broadheads over the last 7 years of archery hunting and they have all worked.

The biggest problem I have had is finding a fixed blade broadhead that flies consistently and shoots the same as my field points.

2 or 3 seasons ago I had a guy who worked at an archery shop recommend Trophy Taker Shuttle T broadheads. They are by far the most consistent flying broadhead I have used. I have shot 2 spike elk and 2 bucks with them, and all 4 animals were dead within 50 yards.

I know I have a small sample size, but as of right now I really really really like the Shuttle T's.

They are hard to sharpen however, thats probably the biggest downside.

"You sure you know how to skin grizz,
pilgrim?"
 
its against the law to shoot expandables in idaho so it is better to just get a fixed blade and go practice with it.

Antelope are one of the easiest to kill so it wont matter what your using as long as it "flies like your field tips." Elk aren't hard to kill either if you get a broad head "that flies like your field tips" and put it where its supposed to go. Get my drift? "flies like your field tips" there are a few that stick out and do exactly that. Wack'em, g5, shuttle t lock, are just a few examples.

good luck this fall sounds like it will be fun

avatar_2528.jpg
 
Fixed all the way and if you get the arrow spine right you can shoot any head you want and hit with your field tips. I prefer thick blades, .050 or thicker, 52 to 54 rockwell hardness and cut on contact. These type of heads are elk killers but there is nothing wrong with being over arrowed for smaller game. With a national wound rate on deer averaging 55%, it only makes sense to shoot elk killer arrows at deer and not take part in this disturbing statistic.
 
I agree with everything Anaconda said, with the exception of the sharpness of solid heads. I believe you can get them plenty sharp. Furthermore, and an even more important consideration that rarely seems to occur to many bowhunters, is sharpness retention AFTER imapact. Everyone always talks about how sharp a head is out of the package, before it even hits an animal. While that is important, sure, what is also important is the ability of the edge to stay sharp after it hits the onside shoulder blade, or rib, or mud caked hair and hide. A replaceable blade head might have a blade like a scalple that is so sharp its scary, but if the edge so thin that it rolls over or chips on impact, it does little good once or if it reaches the vitals. Unfortunatley a lot of replaceable blades these days are built with an edge angle so steep (compared to the 30 deg. on a one piece) to make them feel sharp, that it sacrifices the structural integrity of the edge surface. That is not a tradeoff I want. I can make a one piece head shave in seconds, and I know that even after contact with bone the edge will remain intact and do it's job once it reaches the vitals.

I can also practice with the EXACT same head and arrow combo I am going to hunt with. Just sharpen up and back in the quiver. That gives me confidence.
 
LAST EDITED ON May-29-12 AT 09:53PM (MST)[p]I've never heard such scientific nonsense. So, you're telling me that my replaceable blade Muzzy blades that I've been using for over 20 years and have killed well over a hundred animals with, the blades will roll over and will not be sharp enough to kill an animal after entering it? I disagree. How come none of my razor sharp knives have a 30 degree edge?

The problem with fixed blade broadheads is that most guys will never learn to sharpen them and more importantly most will never take the time to sharpen them... I'm one of those guys.

Apples and oranges... Ed F

http://community.webshots.com/user/bowuntr
 
LAST EDITED ON May-29-12 AT 10:18PM (MST)[p]

No, I never said Muzzy. I've actualy never heard of weak Muzzy blades. I didn't mean to make a blanket statement about all replaceable blades. Some are better than others. What I said is probably theoretical in all but the worst bone hits, but certainly can happen with some blades that are made with thin edges so that they feel really sharp. It's also important to keep in mind that a Broadhead when fired cuts tissue as it passes front to back parallel to the blade, rather than at 90 degrees to the blade the way most people feel or test for sharpness. Most of these types of one piece heads are probably sharper than they "feel".

And knives don't strike bone or other hard tissue at high impact. Unless we are talking about a cleaver, and they do have a hgh degree angle, probably more than 30 degrees.

I do agree with you that most people won't take the time to sharpen them. That's fine. Im not saying they are for everyone. I actually enjoy the sharpening process and find it gratifying.

Now stop poking and go wash your undies!
 
So I have always just bought replacement blades and never done any re-sharpening. I am also in the market for a new broadhead, since G5 doesn't make my Tekkan II anymore. I am also on the fence between fixed and mechanical. Assuming I do end up going with fixed blade broadheads, like the muzzy, how do you sharpen those little blades effectively?
 
I have to assume you guys all have pretty soft ground and no rocks to speak of?? If you miss or have a pass through shot here in Az. you're not going to be reusing your broadheads on anything unless you have one lucky broadhead hit between the rocks?if there is such a thing as in between the rocks. I have always thrown out my broadheads after a kill anyway. They did the job they were designed to do and I figure their probably the cheapest of all of my equipment for bow hunting so I replace them.

GBA
 
hi im mitchel and i am 12 years old and i am the son of the guy who owns wacem broadheads and i know they are great because my dad shoots them at deer and every time he killed one with his bow he always used wacem broadheads
 

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