Enough is Enough

D

dogwood

Guest
I just looked over the list of tags that are sold to the highest bidder! What a Freakin Joke, Utah has totally succeeded in Europeanizing hunting in this state. Its pathetic. I am done with it, I am tired of being screwed, I am tired of the money grubing division, I am tired of the Special Interest groups that reap the benifits from our wildlife, I am tired of not being able to hunt as a family, I am tired of all the crap that goes on with guides who think they own the mountain, I am tired of the competition, I am tired of the lies the division feeds about animal numbers, I am tired of spending money hunting ghosts. And I am tired of a lot more that you probably don't want to hear about. I am sad my children won't experience the outdoors that I grew up knowing. So my fellow hunters, Good luck to you all, you WILL NOT SEE ME amongst you anymore, I have no more fight in me, its just not worth it, I join the ranks of so many freinds and family that have given up what we all used to love so much. Somehow it has changed, it is gone. and for all you greedy, competative sorts who have ruined this state for hunting, congradulations, your wish has come true.!!!!!!!!!!
 
I just looked over the list of tags that are sold to the highest bidder! What a Freakin Joke, Utah has totally succeeded in Europeanizing hunting in this state. Its pathetic. I am done with it, I am tired of being screwed, I am tired of the money grubing division, I am tired of the Special Interest groups that reap the benifits from our wildlife, I am tired of not being able to hunt as a family, I am tired of all the crap that goes on with guides who think they own the mountain, I am tired of the competition, I am tired of the lies the division feeds about animal numbers, I am tired of spending money hunting ghosts. And I am tired of a lot more that you probably don't want to hear about. I am sad my children won't experience the outdoors that I grew up knowing. So my fellow hunters, Good luck to you all, you WILL NOT SEE ME amongst you anymore, I have no more fight in me, its just not worth it, I join the ranks of so many freinds and family that have given up what we all used to love so much. Somehow it has changed, it is gone. and for all you greedy, competative sorts who have ruined this state for hunting, congradulations, your wish has come true.!!!!!!!!!!
 
TAAAA DAAAAA !!! Now We're Talkin !!!
Finally found a Utard in my line of thinkin!!! You tha Man DogWood!!!
If enough people started thinking like the normal people,,, we'd all get to go hunting again. (And Enjoy the good'ol Days) but it's sad to say the dips are winning. Oh well, lots of other things to do for enjoyment. Screw'em.
Hope you find other hobbies dude.
 
TAAAA DAAAAA !!! Now We're Talkin !!!
Finally found a Utard in my line of thinkin!!! You tha Man DogWood!!!
If enough people started thinking like the normal people,,, we'd all get to go hunting again. (And Enjoy the good'ol Days) but it's sad to say the dips are winning. Oh well, lots of other things to do for enjoyment. Screw'em.
Hope you find other hobbies dude.
 
I wont call you a Utard because I feel your pain Dogwood.But I will call the division and those selling out the once great hunting Utah had for average guys, UTARDS!!!! Im just glad I burned all my points last year and now Utah and the UTARDS that run it can kiss my butt!! I wonder if the day has finaly arrived? does Cali have better opportunity than Utah? BH1
 
I wont call you a Utard because I feel your pain Dogwood.But I will call the division and those selling out the once great hunting Utah had for average guys, UTARDS!!!! Im just glad I burned all my points last year and now Utah and the UTARDS that run it can kiss my butt!! I wonder if the day has finaly arrived? does Cali have better opportunity than Utah? BH1
 
Reddog, great Idea, i'll have plenty of time on my hands now, I am serious, I am done, I have really made the descision that enough is enough. Maybe I'll take up Painting or something!
 
Reddog, great Idea, i'll have plenty of time on my hands now, I am serious, I am done, I have really made the descision that enough is enough. Maybe I'll take up Painting or something!
 
Pathetic attitude. I guarantee with those types of comments, you never did have half the love for hunting you think you did. There is still great opportunity out there, even for the common hunter. Let me give you some examples. This past year I got lucky and drew a premium elk tag in New Mexico. I took what I consider a great bull. I also took a decent buck on the Utah Muzzleloader hunt. That was a FUN hunt. I also took a pronghorn and whitetail in Wyoming on LEFTOVER tags. All the while spending time with family and friends. Every hunting season can be great if you choose for it to be. What a freaking pity party. Like I said....pathetic. Hopefully you are just venting and dont really feel things are this bad. I hope you can change your attitude because we need more hunters, not more washed up hunters throwing in the towel.
http://www.monstermuleys.info/cgi-b..._thread&om=13059&forum=DCForumID5&archive=yes
 
Pathetic attitude. I guarantee with those types of comments, you never did have half the love for hunting you think you did. There is still great opportunity out there, even for the common hunter. Let me give you some examples. This past year I got lucky and drew a premium elk tag in New Mexico. I took what I consider a great bull. I also took a decent buck on the Utah Muzzleloader hunt. That was a FUN hunt. I also took a pronghorn and whitetail in Wyoming on LEFTOVER tags. All the while spending time with family and friends. Every hunting season can be great if you choose for it to be. What a freaking pity party. Like I said....pathetic. Hopefully you are just venting and dont really feel things are this bad. I hope you can change your attitude because we need more hunters, not more washed up hunters throwing in the towel.
http://www.monstermuleys.info/cgi-b..._thread&om=13059&forum=DCForumID5&archive=yes
 
What are you people smoking......I understand the frustration with the selling of the LE tags, but y'all sound like a bunch of twelve year old girls. "I didn't have a buck of a lifetime walk into camp this year, cause you sold the one LE tag I was gonna draw, so I am going home." Competition? There has always been competition. Can't hunt as a family?
Don't change your hobby, change your motivation. Since when does everyone have to have a tag to hunt together. A successful hunt in my camp is more than just taking a trophy. Hunting to me is about being in the Mountains with the people I care about. I don't care if I have a tag in my pocket or not, I will be there with them, freezing my ars off as the sun comes up, so excited that I am ready to peee myself, all for a chance at a spike bull or a two point buck.
There is a wealth of opportunity out there for anyone who has the passion. Hunting will always morn the loss of another hunter. I am sad to see a generation pass away without the opportunity to feel that passion and experience that sunrise.

Good luck with the needlepoint


I just want to be friends.
 
What are you people smoking......I understand the frustration with the selling of the LE tags, but y'all sound like a bunch of twelve year old girls. "I didn't have a buck of a lifetime walk into camp this year, cause you sold the one LE tag I was gonna draw, so I am going home." Competition? There has always been competition. Can't hunt as a family?
Don't change your hobby, change your motivation. Since when does everyone have to have a tag to hunt together. A successful hunt in my camp is more than just taking a trophy. Hunting to me is about being in the Mountains with the people I care about. I don't care if I have a tag in my pocket or not, I will be there with them, freezing my ars off as the sun comes up, so excited that I am ready to peee myself, all for a chance at a spike bull or a two point buck.
There is a wealth of opportunity out there for anyone who has the passion. Hunting will always morn the loss of another hunter. I am sad to see a generation pass away without the opportunity to feel that passion and experience that sunrise.

Good luck with the needlepoint


I just want to be friends.
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-10-09 AT 10:15PM (MST)[p]Pathetic Attitude is right. This type of attitude is really what is going to distroy the sport we all love. I agree it is a shame that it is becomeing more of a rich mans sport, but if we all just roll over and die such as your sugesting you are going to do then the sport we all love will end. And when that happens then what happens to the wildlife that we love? If no one is there to stand up and fight for what we love than what is the freaking point. Not to mention the opourtuntiy your robing from the next generation of hunters. I will continue to do what I can to make it not so. You sir are the bigger problem. Pathetic in deed!!!!!

DeadI/Jared
46e8aeb1660028c5.gif
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-10-09 AT 10:15PM (MST)[p]Pathetic Attitude is right. This type of attitude is really what is going to distroy the sport we all love. I agree it is a shame that it is becomeing more of a rich mans sport, but if we all just roll over and die such as your sugesting you are going to do then the sport we all love will end. And when that happens then what happens to the wildlife that we love? If no one is there to stand up and fight for what we love than what is the freaking point. Not to mention the opourtuntiy your robing from the next generation of hunters. I will continue to do what I can to make it not so. You sir are the bigger problem. Pathetic in deed!!!!!

DeadI/Jared
46e8aeb1660028c5.gif
 
Look guys, I have spent 40 years giving this sport all the passion I could muster, I lived to hunt, year round I anticipated the hunts, It was always better than christmas. Just look at what this has all turned into. Yes there are opportunities out there, but guys its not looking good, Hunting has turned into killing, i love the outdoors and will contunue to camp and fish and spend time in the outdoors, but like I have said, the experience of the hunt as I have known it is gone, its not fun anymore, you young guys can speak out against me all you want but you don't know what it was like and how its is now. Its ugly now, its not even the same game. Call me names, disrespect me, whatever, I have been through it. If you cant see its all about the money now then I am sorry for you. the deer heards are tanking, we are slaughtering all our elk, areas that held elk 5 years ago are now turning into desolate canyons. how many cows can you kill of the nebo unit and still have a herd. go up there tell me there are as many elk! If you all feel good about what the hunts have to offer, fine enjoy it, I am just sorry you never got to experience the real joy of hunting with family and freinds, It was about filling the freezer for the family for winter. It was about teaching your sons how to hunt and enjoy the wildlife. I will still do that now, but without a gun in my hand, and no tag. Its time to carry the camera and just enjoy whats left. I am just venting here a bit, but trust me, I have fought the fight, my heart is just not in it anymore. Sorry guys its your battle now.
 
Look guys, I have spent 40 years giving this sport all the passion I could muster, I lived to hunt, year round I anticipated the hunts, It was always better than christmas. Just look at what this has all turned into. Yes there are opportunities out there, but guys its not looking good, Hunting has turned into killing, i love the outdoors and will contunue to camp and fish and spend time in the outdoors, but like I have said, the experience of the hunt as I have known it is gone, its not fun anymore, you young guys can speak out against me all you want but you don't know what it was like and how its is now. Its ugly now, its not even the same game. Call me names, disrespect me, whatever, I have been through it. If you cant see its all about the money now then I am sorry for you. the deer heards are tanking, we are slaughtering all our elk, areas that held elk 5 years ago are now turning into desolate canyons. how many cows can you kill of the nebo unit and still have a herd. go up there tell me there are as many elk! If you all feel good about what the hunts have to offer, fine enjoy it, I am just sorry you never got to experience the real joy of hunting with family and freinds, It was about filling the freezer for the family for winter. It was about teaching your sons how to hunt and enjoy the wildlife. I will still do that now, but without a gun in my hand, and no tag. Its time to carry the camera and just enjoy whats left. I am just venting here a bit, but trust me, I have fought the fight, my heart is just not in it anymore. Sorry guys its your battle now.
 
agreed. Money runs the show. The numbers they have on wildlife populations dont add up to what I see. If we dont b*tch about it... nothing will change, and it needs to.
 
agreed. Money runs the show. The numbers they have on wildlife populations dont add up to what I see. If we dont b*tch about it... nothing will change, and it needs to.
 
I'm with carbon on this.

I'm 62 and I cherish every day afield that I can get in. Season or not, tag or not.

I don't care who buys what. If you hunt public land it seldom affects you.

All that stuff you are whining about has been around for years....get over it. If it all bothers you that much, then you simply never learned how to live out of the way of it.

You aren't your own man?
Can't make your own decisions?
Can't leave the couch and plan a hunt in an isolated area?

You are the one who never learned to appreciate what you have.......instead you would rather whine about what you think you lost.

I'm sorry for you, but.... BYE BYE!
 
I'm with carbon on this.

I'm 62 and I cherish every day afield that I can get in. Season or not, tag or not.

I don't care who buys what. If you hunt public land it seldom affects you.

All that stuff you are whining about has been around for years....get over it. If it all bothers you that much, then you simply never learned how to live out of the way of it.

You aren't your own man?
Can't make your own decisions?
Can't leave the couch and plan a hunt in an isolated area?

You are the one who never learned to appreciate what you have.......instead you would rather whine about what you think you lost.

I'm sorry for you, but.... BYE BYE!
 
hunting is a kind of growth process for most people. you start off thrilled to be out in the field with the guys. then it is a little more about the animal. then you take as much or more pleasure in seeing some of the young hunters harvest an animal and it becomes less about your own hunt. Maybe your just at that stage, you've come to a point where your more happy to see your kid take a nice animal and it doesn't matter how you do. If you still want to be out and harvesting something of your own, you maybe just need to expand your horizons. last year I hunted whitetails in my home state, I went on a deer hunt to ontario, and I went on a wy antelope hunt. not one of which was guided, and anyone with a couple buddies and 4-5 days in the fall could easily afford. sometimes you score sometimes you don't but that isn't how a hunt is measured to me. for everyone else the only trip i was empty on was the ontario rifle hunt. oh well, the wife and i had fun!
 
hunting is a kind of growth process for most people. you start off thrilled to be out in the field with the guys. then it is a little more about the animal. then you take as much or more pleasure in seeing some of the young hunters harvest an animal and it becomes less about your own hunt. Maybe your just at that stage, you've come to a point where your more happy to see your kid take a nice animal and it doesn't matter how you do. If you still want to be out and harvesting something of your own, you maybe just need to expand your horizons. last year I hunted whitetails in my home state, I went on a deer hunt to ontario, and I went on a wy antelope hunt. not one of which was guided, and anyone with a couple buddies and 4-5 days in the fall could easily afford. sometimes you score sometimes you don't but that isn't how a hunt is measured to me. for everyone else the only trip i was empty on was the ontario rifle hunt. oh well, the wife and i had fun!
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-09 AT 00:13AM (MST)[p]And on a positive note: NEXT YEARS DRAWING ODDS JUST GOT BETTER, BY A FACTOR OF ONE! Anyone else care to take up painting as well. (I know that's selfish of me to think that way. I just like to try and find the positive side of things).
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-09 AT 00:13AM (MST)[p]And on a positive note: NEXT YEARS DRAWING ODDS JUST GOT BETTER, BY A FACTOR OF ONE! Anyone else care to take up painting as well. (I know that's selfish of me to think that way. I just like to try and find the positive side of things).
 
>Pathetic attitude. I guarantee with those
>types of comments, you never
>did have half the love
>for hunting you think you
>did. There is still great
>opportunity out there, even for
>the common hunter. Let me
>give you some examples. This
>past year I got lucky
>and drew a premium elk
>tag in New Mexico. I
>took what I consider a
>great bull. I also took
>a decent buck on the
>Utah Muzzleloader hunt. That was
>a FUN hunt. I also
>took a pronghorn and whitetail
>in Wyoming on LEFTOVER tags.
>http://www.monstermuleys.info/cgi-b..._thread&om=13059&forum=DCForumID5&archive=yes

Well, I am certainly not ready to throw in my towel yet, but I don't think you make good examples for the average "joe hunter" Many can't hunt out of state as you suggest he do.

What is the count up to? 320+ tags sold to the highest bidder? When will it be too much? Do all other states combined sell that many tags?


txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
 
>Pathetic attitude. I guarantee with those
>types of comments, you never
>did have half the love
>for hunting you think you
>did. There is still great
>opportunity out there, even for
>the common hunter. Let me
>give you some examples. This
>past year I got lucky
>and drew a premium elk
>tag in New Mexico. I
>took what I consider a
>great bull. I also took
>a decent buck on the
>Utah Muzzleloader hunt. That was
>a FUN hunt. I also
>took a pronghorn and whitetail
>in Wyoming on LEFTOVER tags.
>http://www.monstermuleys.info/cgi-b..._thread&om=13059&forum=DCForumID5&archive=yes

Well, I am certainly not ready to throw in my towel yet, but I don't think you make good examples for the average "joe hunter" Many can't hunt out of state as you suggest he do.

What is the count up to? 320+ tags sold to the highest bidder? When will it be too much? Do all other states combined sell that many tags?


txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
 
I won't lie, I have been frustrated with Utah hunting many times. However, it would be a shame to give up fighting and not give your kids the great experiences of hunting:

Here are my ideas:

1- Apply your kids for a youth only elk hunt

2- Apply them for a cow (elk) tag. Many areas are better than 50% draw odds and have good harvest statistics.

3- Get them into archery or Muzzloader hunting (if you want to escape the crowds). There are always some deer around. I dont think your kids will care if they shoot a B&C Buck. I am sure they would be happy with an average buck.

4- Get them in to duck hunting, grouse hunting, chukar hunting....

I like Nicks attitude. One of the great hunts I had was camping in the Uintahs a few years back. Spent a few days camping in a wall tent and didn't see a thing. It was still a great trip.

If you think giving up 320 "tags" has destroyed hunting, look at how many LE quality tags were in the draw this year, available for us "Average Joes"
 
I won't lie, I have been frustrated with Utah hunting many times. However, it would be a shame to give up fighting and not give your kids the great experiences of hunting:

Here are my ideas:

1- Apply your kids for a youth only elk hunt

2- Apply them for a cow (elk) tag. Many areas are better than 50% draw odds and have good harvest statistics.

3- Get them into archery or Muzzloader hunting (if you want to escape the crowds). There are always some deer around. I dont think your kids will care if they shoot a B&C Buck. I am sure they would be happy with an average buck.

4- Get them in to duck hunting, grouse hunting, chukar hunting....

I like Nicks attitude. One of the great hunts I had was camping in the Uintahs a few years back. Spent a few days camping in a wall tent and didn't see a thing. It was still a great trip.

If you think giving up 320 "tags" has destroyed hunting, look at how many LE quality tags were in the draw this year, available for us "Average Joes"
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-09 AT 08:53AM (MST)[p] Please come back to hunting we need you!!!!

Just kiddin...... See ya don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!!
Cry azz! "Special intrest group"?????
Sounds like you have your own special intrest group! Your self! And if you don't get your way your going to throw a fit, pout and cry. GET THE F OUT! DONT WANT YOU OR YOUR WHINE AZZ KIDS ON THE MOUNTAIN!




"I'll keep my Freedom, I'll keep my Money, I'll keep my guns! You keep the change.
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
 
LAST EDITED ON Mar-11-09 AT 08:53AM (MST)[p] Please come back to hunting we need you!!!!

Just kiddin...... See ya don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!!
Cry azz! "Special intrest group"?????
Sounds like you have your own special intrest group! Your self! And if you don't get your way your going to throw a fit, pout and cry. GET THE F OUT! DONT WANT YOU OR YOUR WHINE AZZ KIDS ON THE MOUNTAIN!




"I'll keep my Freedom, I'll keep my Money, I'll keep my guns! You keep the change.
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
 
I know exactly how Dogwood feels about Utah. I didn't quit hunting, I moved. I'd had it with Utah, it is a seriously screwed up state when it comes to hunting. I have been gone for 18 years and haven't missed it once or had any desire to go back. The difference in the quality of hunting I have enjoyed the last 18 years compared to the pathetic opportunities Utah had to offer is night and day. Not everyone can move, but hunting was important enough to me I had to, as Utah didn't provide enough quality or opportunity for some one that loves to hunt as much as I do. No regrets.
 
I know exactly how Dogwood feels about Utah. I didn't quit hunting, I moved. I'd had it with Utah, it is a seriously screwed up state when it comes to hunting. I have been gone for 18 years and haven't missed it once or had any desire to go back. The difference in the quality of hunting I have enjoyed the last 18 years compared to the pathetic opportunities Utah had to offer is night and day. Not everyone can move, but hunting was important enough to me I had to, as Utah didn't provide enough quality or opportunity for some one that loves to hunt as much as I do. No regrets.
 
Well then.........got any good equipment you want to sell cheap?

nunya,
It looks as though we have the same signature line. But I think I had mine first :)






















"I'll keep my guns, freedom, and money.
You can keep the "change"!"
 
Well then.........got any good equipment you want to sell cheap?

nunya,
It looks as though we have the same signature line. But I think I had mine first :)






















"I'll keep my guns, freedom, and money.
You can keep the "change"!"
 
I don't get this post.

It's people like dogwood that give hunting a bad name. Quitters. Bitchers. Whiners. Cyber tissue is right. Dry your eyes you might actually see the light through your haze.

You think the guides own the mountains? #####, where I hunt you won't EVER see a guide. I manage to go, with family, and have a very nice hunt every year. I have yet to EVER draw a LE tag in the pathetic draw, but you won't find me quitting.

Hunting is growing, not regressing. The difference is, its growing in the youth and 20-30 crowd, and my feeling is that it pisses some of you 50-60 crowd off that the young bucks actually want to hike their asses off, join an outfitting group, or God forbid, bid on a hunt.
 
I don't get this post.

It's people like dogwood that give hunting a bad name. Quitters. Bitchers. Whiners. Cyber tissue is right. Dry your eyes you might actually see the light through your haze.

You think the guides own the mountains? #####, where I hunt you won't EVER see a guide. I manage to go, with family, and have a very nice hunt every year. I have yet to EVER draw a LE tag in the pathetic draw, but you won't find me quitting.

Hunting is growing, not regressing. The difference is, its growing in the youth and 20-30 crowd, and my feeling is that it pisses some of you 50-60 crowd off that the young bucks actually want to hike their asses off, join an outfitting group, or God forbid, bid on a hunt.
 
dogwood, I don't live in Utah, but I do live in CA which I bet is worse than Utah. I get very discouraged myself sometimes. You have to learn how to adapt, especially if you can't afford to go out of State.

I've been hunting for over 40 years and I look back fondly to the years gone by. But those days are gone forever. Everything changes. It's harder now just to find a good PLACE to hunt than it was to find a good buck back in the day. Plus the older you get the harder it is to adapt.

We all talk about introducing kids to hunting and how satisfying that is. But I kind of reversed the roles here lately. I work with a few younger guys who love to hunt and frankly have a lot more energy than me. I've kind of hooked up with them the last couple years. I teach them a few things and they go out of their way to help me. I still like to hunt alone sometimes, but a couple weekends a year we hunt together. I really enjoy their enthusiasm and drive, and for me that really reminds me of the old days, and helps keep me going. And I appriciate it a bunch. They are too young to know how screwed up things are, and I'm not about to tell them!:) They still think there is a buck behind every tree!

The point is you can't change what is so you have to have the right attitude and make good things happen. There are still plenty of opportunities and great memories out there.

Eel
 
dogwood, I don't live in Utah, but I do live in CA which I bet is worse than Utah. I get very discouraged myself sometimes. You have to learn how to adapt, especially if you can't afford to go out of State.

I've been hunting for over 40 years and I look back fondly to the years gone by. But those days are gone forever. Everything changes. It's harder now just to find a good PLACE to hunt than it was to find a good buck back in the day. Plus the older you get the harder it is to adapt.

We all talk about introducing kids to hunting and how satisfying that is. But I kind of reversed the roles here lately. I work with a few younger guys who love to hunt and frankly have a lot more energy than me. I've kind of hooked up with them the last couple years. I teach them a few things and they go out of their way to help me. I still like to hunt alone sometimes, but a couple weekends a year we hunt together. I really enjoy their enthusiasm and drive, and for me that really reminds me of the old days, and helps keep me going. And I appriciate it a bunch. They are too young to know how screwed up things are, and I'm not about to tell them!:) They still think there is a buck behind every tree!

The point is you can't change what is so you have to have the right attitude and make good things happen. There are still plenty of opportunities and great memories out there.

Eel
 
The problem is too many people. No way can things stay the same. There are more of us taking up more space [habitat] and competing for the same or less numbers of animals. Alot of you complain about the auction tags but that money is part of the solution not the problem. If we work together we can maximize the hunting potential which granted is getting less. Until the human population starts decreasing things will continue to get tougher.
 
The problem is too many people. No way can things stay the same. There are more of us taking up more space [habitat] and competing for the same or less numbers of animals. Alot of you complain about the auction tags but that money is part of the solution not the problem. If we work together we can maximize the hunting potential which granted is getting less. Until the human population starts decreasing things will continue to get tougher.
 
there have been some good points made on this thread, some I disagree with. The point is, there is plenty of opportunity even here in Utah, but why limit yourself to one state no matter where you live? ANY amount of time spent in the woods in my mind is quality time. I am not one of those that is happy to see more hunters throw in the towel just because it gives me better opportunity...unless that person has such a poor attitude that it reflects poorly on the rest of us. Hunters need to stick together, not tear each other down
 
there have been some good points made on this thread, some I disagree with. The point is, there is plenty of opportunity even here in Utah, but why limit yourself to one state no matter where you live? ANY amount of time spent in the woods in my mind is quality time. I am not one of those that is happy to see more hunters throw in the towel just because it gives me better opportunity...unless that person has such a poor attitude that it reflects poorly on the rest of us. Hunters need to stick together, not tear each other down
 
I dont know what part of the state dogwood lives in, but even here in the north i hear older guys whining about this, " i cant take my family hunting" bunch of crap. more like " i cant roll my lazy butt to the hardware store the day before the hunt and get my tag because they are sold out" and i guess they seem to forget that there is always otc elk hunts, and now spike tags in every fricken unit.

guys who care built a great elk heard and a few great deer units, not everyone can hunt them, bide your time in general units till its your turn, or god forbid travel to other states. i guess thats too much to ask, you must not love it that much.
 
I dont know what part of the state dogwood lives in, but even here in the north i hear older guys whining about this, " i cant take my family hunting" bunch of crap. more like " i cant roll my lazy butt to the hardware store the day before the hunt and get my tag because they are sold out" and i guess they seem to forget that there is always otc elk hunts, and now spike tags in every fricken unit.

guys who care built a great elk heard and a few great deer units, not everyone can hunt them, bide your time in general units till its your turn, or god forbid travel to other states. i guess thats too much to ask, you must not love it that much.
 
Sremim, I think I had my signature first. You can have it. as you can see I have changed mine.



---------------------------------------
Mike Sucks.

"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
 
Sremim, I think I had my signature first. You can have it. as you can see I have changed mine.



---------------------------------------
Mike Sucks.

"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
 
Man some of you guys are way sensative! The site was boring lately so I though I would stir it up a bit. I could never really leave hunting, its in the blood. But you all have to admit it gets frustrating as hell. But I will tell you what, I have thought about it a time or to, many family members and freinds that lived and died by hunting have just left and never looked back. They make it look so easy! But when your addictited to hunting like I am its just not so easy. Alot of my rant was real frustration, as hunters what can we do to help our heratige continue, When will enough of us stand up to the powers that be, yes I know we can all find a place to go hunt, But it is very diffucult to teach my teenagers who can't even seem to draw a general deer tag to like hunting when they don't ever get the chance to do it. I take them rabbit hunting, bird hunting, fishing etc. It just seems it is not enticing enough to let them catch hold of it. There are WAY to many things drawing them in different directions. Sorry to stir you all up, but sometimes a bit of controversy is fun, right. See you on the Mountain, and maybe I will take up painting to, Later
 
Man some of you guys are way sensative! The site was boring lately so I though I would stir it up a bit. I could never really leave hunting, its in the blood. But you all have to admit it gets frustrating as hell. But I will tell you what, I have thought about it a time or to, many family members and freinds that lived and died by hunting have just left and never looked back. They make it look so easy! But when your addictited to hunting like I am its just not so easy. Alot of my rant was real frustration, as hunters what can we do to help our heratige continue, When will enough of us stand up to the powers that be, yes I know we can all find a place to go hunt, But it is very diffucult to teach my teenagers who can't even seem to draw a general deer tag to like hunting when they don't ever get the chance to do it. I take them rabbit hunting, bird hunting, fishing etc. It just seems it is not enticing enough to let them catch hold of it. There are WAY to many things drawing them in different directions. Sorry to stir you all up, but sometimes a bit of controversy is fun, right. See you on the Mountain, and maybe I will take up painting to, Later
 
Dogwood you made some very excellent points. I am sick of alot of the special interests taking hold of so much. My kids do like the outdoors, but its not the same and I don't think its going to take ahold of them like it did me. It's not as fun as it use to be.
Here's an idea. I think sportsmen need to run the Fish and Game departments as a democracy under a constitution. The Fish and Game constitution would be to protect from the anti hunters. We elect a board of six or eight people who run the department. These people are elected by sportsmen who hold a current license. Hopefully this would stop the special interests from continuing to take over everything. This would return the control back to hunters and fishermen where it belongs.
 
Dogwood you made some very excellent points. I am sick of alot of the special interests taking hold of so much. My kids do like the outdoors, but its not the same and I don't think its going to take ahold of them like it did me. It's not as fun as it use to be.
Here's an idea. I think sportsmen need to run the Fish and Game departments as a democracy under a constitution. The Fish and Game constitution would be to protect from the anti hunters. We elect a board of six or eight people who run the department. These people are elected by sportsmen who hold a current license. Hopefully this would stop the special interests from continuing to take over everything. This would return the control back to hunters and fishermen where it belongs.
 
frontier, things have changed, but just remember that they were probly different for your dad or who ever introduced hunting to you, than it was when they learned. it is what you make it, if your having a bad time, your kids probly will to.
 
frontier, things have changed, but just remember that they were probly different for your dad or who ever introduced hunting to you, than it was when they learned. it is what you make it, if your having a bad time, your kids probly will to.
 
i would gladly pay double or triple what i pay as a resident of colorado to hunt here if that meant less hunting pressure and better chances to draw the quality units by keeping more tags for residents. if you look at the other states, CO has a great pp system. i cant stand the fact that someone in Utah that has 0 points can draw over someone with 10 pts. Its like going to the grocery store, get in line and wait. CO gives more tags to non residents than any other state, so if you dont like your odds or the cost dont come. that being said, i highly doubt any changes will be made to the current system except something with point creep. just my thoughts
 
i would gladly pay double or triple what i pay as a resident of colorado to hunt here if that meant less hunting pressure and better chances to draw the quality units by keeping more tags for residents. if you look at the other states, CO has a great pp system. i cant stand the fact that someone in Utah that has 0 points can draw over someone with 10 pts. Its like going to the grocery store, get in line and wait. CO gives more tags to non residents than any other state, so if you dont like your odds or the cost dont come. that being said, i highly doubt any changes will be made to the current system except something with point creep. just my thoughts
 
Dog, based on your last, your real issue is the young'uns don't have the desire to hunt??? Cause they can't get a LE tag??

NOT ALL KIDS ARE GONNA ENJOY HUNTIN!!!!!!!!

My dad created a monster. He's said 100s of times that if he had known I'd get as into huntin as I have for the last 40 years, he might not have started me.

I started huntin planted pheasants, then ducks, then archery deer and eventually ANYTHING!! At one point I'd rather have duck hunted than deer hunted as it was about the killing.

I started my kids with youth birds hunts, then big game. Daughter quit after seeing a quartered cow elk laying in the snow. She still enjoys birds. Son never took to it like me but very rarily tapped out of a hunt. Was I a lil disappointmented??? Heii ya. I asked myself if I made it too hard?? Not comfortable enough?? Nor good enough?? I've come to realize that I don't want them huntin for me but because they want to. As soon as I could drive, I was huntin on my own. Not my son!! I offer and if they accept, I enjoy the hunt. If they decline, I don't give it another thought.

My fiance is now huntin with me. I've told her a 100+ times, don't do it for me. I really think she enjoys it cause she gets a glazed look in her eyes when game is in sight BUT if she stopped tomorrow, I'd still be gone 30-60 days a year and make it up to her the rest of the year.

BUT I'LL NEVER STOP NO MATTER WHAT THE F&G DOES!!!!!!
 
Dog, based on your last, your real issue is the young'uns don't have the desire to hunt??? Cause they can't get a LE tag??

NOT ALL KIDS ARE GONNA ENJOY HUNTIN!!!!!!!!

My dad created a monster. He's said 100s of times that if he had known I'd get as into huntin as I have for the last 40 years, he might not have started me.

I started huntin planted pheasants, then ducks, then archery deer and eventually ANYTHING!! At one point I'd rather have duck hunted than deer hunted as it was about the killing.

I started my kids with youth birds hunts, then big game. Daughter quit after seeing a quartered cow elk laying in the snow. She still enjoys birds. Son never took to it like me but very rarily tapped out of a hunt. Was I a lil disappointmented??? Heii ya. I asked myself if I made it too hard?? Not comfortable enough?? Nor good enough?? I've come to realize that I don't want them huntin for me but because they want to. As soon as I could drive, I was huntin on my own. Not my son!! I offer and if they accept, I enjoy the hunt. If they decline, I don't give it another thought.

My fiance is now huntin with me. I've told her a 100+ times, don't do it for me. I really think she enjoys it cause she gets a glazed look in her eyes when game is in sight BUT if she stopped tomorrow, I'd still be gone 30-60 days a year and make it up to her the rest of the year.

BUT I'LL NEVER STOP NO MATTER WHAT THE F&G DOES!!!!!!
 
All I can say back to you D-wood, is welcome to my world back east in IL, IA, OH, and even begining in IN. The only way in any of those states you will have any chance at a high quality deer hunt is to pay between $15 to $50 per acher leese fees. There are some aceptions, but few and faaaaaar between. Hunting the same farm land year after year is loooooooong gone. I personally know people who do not allow uncles and first cousins to hunt on their land any more because of leesing. The all mighty dollar has even come between families.

The last private property I could hunt in my then home state of IL was owned by a lagitamte multi, multi-millonair. He allowed me to hunt for free, even though I offerd to pay or help him by offering my labor or talents as a electrician at his disposal. He always declined.

Then one year he let me know his son was now going to handel all the hunting property from now on. I thought BOHIC. He then called me in January the fallowing year to inform me his son had been aproached by a out of state outfitter (no less) that was willing to pay him (I sweare to God on this next fact) $7500 a year to leese his 298 acer farm of which 198 acers was in CRP and unhuntable, leaving only 100 acers of actual deer holding huntable habitat. That comes out to a $75 per acer leese fee. He even openly admitted this was insane as there was no way on earth the outfitter could make a profit worth his $$investment and time and still remain ethical in terms of the quality of guided hunts who would be selling. He told me the outfitter planed on charging $2300 for five day non-rut bow hunts in the month of October, $3000 for five day bowhunts for the first two (peek rut) weeks of November, and back to $2300 per five day bowhunt for the remainder of the bow season.
The reason we both knew the hunts would never be worth the $$$ is the land was litterally ringed on three sides by leesed land and the woods surounding the property line looked like a condominum complex of tree stands. Mine you this only occured in the last year I hunted the land, but it was fact none the less.

What sickens me most is I have no doubt what so ever in my mind we have seen the beginning of the end of big game hunting in the United States, and worst of all we did it to our selves. Peta and the rest of the bunny huggers must be laughing their collective butts off as it is now only a matter of time and time is on the Anti's side.

I could bore all who are reading this litteraly to tears with dozens of stories told to me by land owners in both Brown and Schulyer CO. in IL about charging huge sums of $$$ to (mostly but not always) out of state hunters to deer hunt, only to have to litteraly "disapere" because all these fools were seeing wear basket racks and does and were none to happy about it. Far to meny hunters read in NA White/T (as well as other rags) how IL seems to be over run with 140 class bucks and there is P&Y behind every tree, and buy into the BS much to their dissapointment.

IMHO for all intents and perposes big game hunting in the US is now a rich mans game ala Europe. I STRONGLY doubt the dream I have of one day elk hunting in the mountains out west with my sons will ever come to pass unless I can some how (highly unlikely) aford 10 of thousands of dollars for a land owners tag in UT or NM.

Hntings epataph will read something like this "WE pritty much F***ed our selves"
 
All I can say back to you D-wood, is welcome to my world back east in IL, IA, OH, and even begining in IN. The only way in any of those states you will have any chance at a high quality deer hunt is to pay between $15 to $50 per acher leese fees. There are some aceptions, but few and faaaaaar between. Hunting the same farm land year after year is loooooooong gone. I personally know people who do not allow uncles and first cousins to hunt on their land any more because of leesing. The all mighty dollar has even come between families.

The last private property I could hunt in my then home state of IL was owned by a lagitamte multi, multi-millonair. He allowed me to hunt for free, even though I offerd to pay or help him by offering my labor or talents as a electrician at his disposal. He always declined.

Then one year he let me know his son was now going to handel all the hunting property from now on. I thought BOHIC. He then called me in January the fallowing year to inform me his son had been aproached by a out of state outfitter (no less) that was willing to pay him (I sweare to God on this next fact) $7500 a year to leese his 298 acer farm of which 198 acers was in CRP and unhuntable, leaving only 100 acers of actual deer holding huntable habitat. That comes out to a $75 per acer leese fee. He even openly admitted this was insane as there was no way on earth the outfitter could make a profit worth his $$investment and time and still remain ethical in terms of the quality of guided hunts who would be selling. He told me the outfitter planed on charging $2300 for five day non-rut bow hunts in the month of October, $3000 for five day bowhunts for the first two (peek rut) weeks of November, and back to $2300 per five day bowhunt for the remainder of the bow season.
The reason we both knew the hunts would never be worth the $$$ is the land was litterally ringed on three sides by leesed land and the woods surounding the property line looked like a condominum complex of tree stands. Mine you this only occured in the last year I hunted the land, but it was fact none the less.

What sickens me most is I have no doubt what so ever in my mind we have seen the beginning of the end of big game hunting in the United States, and worst of all we did it to our selves. Peta and the rest of the bunny huggers must be laughing their collective butts off as it is now only a matter of time and time is on the Anti's side.

I could bore all who are reading this litteraly to tears with dozens of stories told to me by land owners in both Brown and Schulyer CO. in IL about charging huge sums of $$$ to (mostly but not always) out of state hunters to deer hunt, only to have to litteraly "disapere" because all these fools were seeing wear basket racks and does and were none to happy about it. Far to meny hunters read in NA White/T (as well as other rags) how IL seems to be over run with 140 class bucks and there is P&Y behind every tree, and buy into the BS much to their dissapointment.

IMHO for all intents and perposes big game hunting in the US is now a rich mans game ala Europe. I STRONGLY doubt the dream I have of one day elk hunting in the mountains out west with my sons will ever come to pass unless I can some how (highly unlikely) aford 10 of thousands of dollars for a land owners tag in UT or NM.

Hntings epataph will read something like this "WE pritty much F***ed our selves"
 
My thoughts:

1- we used to have 280,000 hunters on opening day of deer season and could take either sex. Now we are down to 90,000. Yes in northern utah their is human encroachment, but most of this state hasn't changed since the old days. I hunt manti, and this region isn't suffering development, yet their aren't deer.

2- their has been an explosion(especially in northern utah) of CWMU's, each has seasons going from aug to nov.

3- An explosion of associations, swf, rmef, du, etc. each of which are given huge ammounts of tags, all of which are a little fuzzy about where the money goes.

4- Hunting has been replaced by killing. I hunt with a group of family and friends. If we all tagged out their would be 20+ tags, we never do, but we all spend the week hunting.

5- The utah dwr is the worst run in the west. We have the nicest trucks, coolest boats, etc. but the worst management in the west. Ever wonder why the bucks bulls RAC is the end of oct.? Their is no way results from the field are in, but new regs and rules are made, which means their is no data or science, just a shot in the dark. Also wonder what the percentage of wildlife biologists is compared to the number of law enforcement agents is.

Easy to get frustrated, pissed, but mostly I get saddened by it all. Dogwood has been right on the money so far
 
My thoughts:

1- we used to have 280,000 hunters on opening day of deer season and could take either sex. Now we are down to 90,000. Yes in northern utah their is human encroachment, but most of this state hasn't changed since the old days. I hunt manti, and this region isn't suffering development, yet their aren't deer.

2- their has been an explosion(especially in northern utah) of CWMU's, each has seasons going from aug to nov.

3- An explosion of associations, swf, rmef, du, etc. each of which are given huge ammounts of tags, all of which are a little fuzzy about where the money goes.

4- Hunting has been replaced by killing. I hunt with a group of family and friends. If we all tagged out their would be 20+ tags, we never do, but we all spend the week hunting.

5- The utah dwr is the worst run in the west. We have the nicest trucks, coolest boats, etc. but the worst management in the west. Ever wonder why the bucks bulls RAC is the end of oct.? Their is no way results from the field are in, but new regs and rules are made, which means their is no data or science, just a shot in the dark. Also wonder what the percentage of wildlife biologists is compared to the number of law enforcement agents is.

Easy to get frustrated, pissed, but mostly I get saddened by it all. Dogwood has been right on the money so far
 
hossblur - good to see you back in the mix! I agree. It's no secret that I support several of the conservation groups but I also agree that there are way too many auction tags. I used to be one of those that thought I couldn't afford to hunt out of state. I have since come to the conclusion that it doesn't cost anymore to hunt out of state than in state. I Wyoming, Colorado and Kansas almost every year. Not that much difference in cost. Example: when I drew my Wasatch LE archery tag 4 years ago I spent roughly $4000.00 on that hunt as a resident. I did not hire a guide but I added up the fuel costs, the food costs, the time off of work, the scouting costs and everything else. That spread over a 4 month period. I hunted Colorado for mule deer that year and spent roughly $800.00 for 5 days including $300 for the NR tag and $500 for food and fuel. Every bit of a hunt as my LE hunt in Utah. When people complain about not being able to afford hunting out of state I really don't think they take into consideration all of the hunting costs associated with driving to and from your hunting area in your home state. Keep track next time. I think it will surprise you. I put in for a moose hunt out of state that is cheaper than my home state. The NR resident cost of hunting a moose in this state is $100 cheaper than hunting one in Utah, and the moose are huge! I plan on hiring a guide when I finally draw that tag but I gaurantee it will cost less to hunt that moose than a moose in my own back yard. Just something to think about.

It's always an adventure!!!
www.awholelottabull.com
 
hossblur - good to see you back in the mix! I agree. It's no secret that I support several of the conservation groups but I also agree that there are way too many auction tags. I used to be one of those that thought I couldn't afford to hunt out of state. I have since come to the conclusion that it doesn't cost anymore to hunt out of state than in state. I Wyoming, Colorado and Kansas almost every year. Not that much difference in cost. Example: when I drew my Wasatch LE archery tag 4 years ago I spent roughly $4000.00 on that hunt as a resident. I did not hire a guide but I added up the fuel costs, the food costs, the time off of work, the scouting costs and everything else. That spread over a 4 month period. I hunted Colorado for mule deer that year and spent roughly $800.00 for 5 days including $300 for the NR tag and $500 for food and fuel. Every bit of a hunt as my LE hunt in Utah. When people complain about not being able to afford hunting out of state I really don't think they take into consideration all of the hunting costs associated with driving to and from your hunting area in your home state. Keep track next time. I think it will surprise you. I put in for a moose hunt out of state that is cheaper than my home state. The NR resident cost of hunting a moose in this state is $100 cheaper than hunting one in Utah, and the moose are huge! I plan on hiring a guide when I finally draw that tag but I gaurantee it will cost less to hunt that moose than a moose in my own back yard. Just something to think about.

It's always an adventure!!!
www.awholelottabull.com
 
"I have since come to the conclusion that it doesn't cost anymore to hunt out of state than in state"

Isn't that the truth!!!
 
"I have since come to the conclusion that it doesn't cost anymore to hunt out of state than in state"

Isn't that the truth!!!
 
+1 what Woodruffhunter said.


"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
 
+1 what Woodruffhunter said.


"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
 
I feel your pain Dogwood,...and agree with a lot of what you've said. The demand has outrun the supply in hunting the west it seems. I don't have the answer to this situation.....nor the money to overcome it either. Maybe some new people are needed in the places that can have an affect on things out there...good luck....hey....take up taxidermy....it kept me busy for over 30 years!
 
I feel your pain Dogwood,...and agree with a lot of what you've said. The demand has outrun the supply in hunting the west it seems. I don't have the answer to this situation.....nor the money to overcome it either. Maybe some new people are needed in the places that can have an affect on things out there...good luck....hey....take up taxidermy....it kept me busy for over 30 years!
 
Hossblur

You make some good points about the way it used to be! I don't know about over 200,000 hunters, but I'm sure there were at least 150,000 hunters. And during those years back in the 60's and early 70's extra tags were available for many units as well as all archery hunters were allowed 2 deer as long as at least 1 was taken with a bow! Many families tagged along together and ma and pa and everyone else bought deer tags for whoever happened to be the lucky guy to walk into a band of deer! Most of us today would call it " Party hunting" and it's still very well practiced in Colorado! That's too bad!
My point is... hunters became much better with all the equipment that came along as well, most hunters advanced from iron sights to scope sighted rifles, everyone became more comfortable camping in their trailers and campers, they began spending more days off in the field and everyone owned 4-wheel drives. With that ingredients it doesn't take long to thin out a deer herd! Think about how fast the Bull Elk herd would dwindle to near zip if everyone could buy over the counter any Bull tags! You and I can both remember those days in the 70's when a group of hunters could spen the entire Elk season and not see any bull and maybe not a cow either!
I'm the first to admit, I absolutely hate the Elk boom in Utah but I didn't always feel that way! I blame the booming Elk herd partly for the diminished deer herd! I'm 62 and hunted limited entry Bulls twice, once when I was 18 and once at 60. To me the loss of deer for the limited Elk opportunity isn't worth it. Of course I know some folks would argue the Elk population has minimal affect on deer but ( I'm not a biologist but experience over the years has proven itself ) The same thing has happened in Colorado!
I also agee with 1 of the other posts on this thread that the herd estimates by regions is unbelievably exaggerated! When I make this remark I include the herd populations in Colorado as well ( I say this because I hunt quite a bit in that state) I've been on wintering ranges and had the helicopters fly right over me doing the counts! I've talked to the biologists personally and they will swear their counts are quite accurate but afterr covering miles and miles through snow and spotting areas a man can see for miles with glasses and scopes, unless the deer can fly I'm not convinced!
Finally, you're absolutely right about one thing! Deer hunting was much more fun back in those early years! But I think it was because everybody participated in it! All the neighbors hunted and deer hunting was always the main shop talk at least a couple of months before the season. When folks returned home from the hunt,neighbors and work mates shared their respective stories. Groups of hunters passed each other on the highway as they returned home, giving a thumbs up to the lucky hunters that displayed their luck by hanging the heads in easy view! Today, it's almost like you have to be ashamed for antlers to be projecting from your vehicle (at least here in Utah) Anyway, that part of "Good Old Days" is over! Sometimes, I think I'd like to give up, but it's in my blood as well. So, I'll just continue on as long as I can, sometimes just tagging with the boys and this year with my grandson's first! Still can't decide just how I want to apply in Colorado, chances are I'll just be watching this year!

BUD
 
Hossblur

You make some good points about the way it used to be! I don't know about over 200,000 hunters, but I'm sure there were at least 150,000 hunters. And during those years back in the 60's and early 70's extra tags were available for many units as well as all archery hunters were allowed 2 deer as long as at least 1 was taken with a bow! Many families tagged along together and ma and pa and everyone else bought deer tags for whoever happened to be the lucky guy to walk into a band of deer! Most of us today would call it " Party hunting" and it's still very well practiced in Colorado! That's too bad!
My point is... hunters became much better with all the equipment that came along as well, most hunters advanced from iron sights to scope sighted rifles, everyone became more comfortable camping in their trailers and campers, they began spending more days off in the field and everyone owned 4-wheel drives. With that ingredients it doesn't take long to thin out a deer herd! Think about how fast the Bull Elk herd would dwindle to near zip if everyone could buy over the counter any Bull tags! You and I can both remember those days in the 70's when a group of hunters could spen the entire Elk season and not see any bull and maybe not a cow either!
I'm the first to admit, I absolutely hate the Elk boom in Utah but I didn't always feel that way! I blame the booming Elk herd partly for the diminished deer herd! I'm 62 and hunted limited entry Bulls twice, once when I was 18 and once at 60. To me the loss of deer for the limited Elk opportunity isn't worth it. Of course I know some folks would argue the Elk population has minimal affect on deer but ( I'm not a biologist but experience over the years has proven itself ) The same thing has happened in Colorado!
I also agee with 1 of the other posts on this thread that the herd estimates by regions is unbelievably exaggerated! When I make this remark I include the herd populations in Colorado as well ( I say this because I hunt quite a bit in that state) I've been on wintering ranges and had the helicopters fly right over me doing the counts! I've talked to the biologists personally and they will swear their counts are quite accurate but afterr covering miles and miles through snow and spotting areas a man can see for miles with glasses and scopes, unless the deer can fly I'm not convinced!
Finally, you're absolutely right about one thing! Deer hunting was much more fun back in those early years! But I think it was because everybody participated in it! All the neighbors hunted and deer hunting was always the main shop talk at least a couple of months before the season. When folks returned home from the hunt,neighbors and work mates shared their respective stories. Groups of hunters passed each other on the highway as they returned home, giving a thumbs up to the lucky hunters that displayed their luck by hanging the heads in easy view! Today, it's almost like you have to be ashamed for antlers to be projecting from your vehicle (at least here in Utah) Anyway, that part of "Good Old Days" is over! Sometimes, I think I'd like to give up, but it's in my blood as well. So, I'll just continue on as long as I can, sometimes just tagging with the boys and this year with my grandson's first! Still can't decide just how I want to apply in Colorado, chances are I'll just be watching this year!

BUD
 
Hey dog you can pick up bird hunting in south dakota if you look you can find three day hunts for 450 dollars lisc 100.00 figure you're food and gas. maybe take up sporting clays, it's frustrating but they want you to quit the dwr,wants big money hunters here and those tags do alot of good for projects, my only ##### is that alot of those projects are done private lands kudos to the public land projects that they do.
 
Hey dog you can pick up bird hunting in south dakota if you look you can find three day hunts for 450 dollars lisc 100.00 figure you're food and gas. maybe take up sporting clays, it's frustrating but they want you to quit the dwr,wants big money hunters here and those tags do alot of good for projects, my only ##### is that alot of those projects are done private lands kudos to the public land projects that they do.
 
Dogwood; I feel your pain, man. I personally am not far from your position, also. This sport in the post 'Super Slam' era,has become riddled with cancer and is just waiting to die. Guys talk about our need for numbers, then jump on you like a pack of jackals smelling blood because you have tired of what this sport has become. It would be my guess that if Jack O'Conner came back to see the changes in this sport and the type of attitudes held by today's hunters, he would take up another sport, also. I'm sure there are other activities that one can pursue that will keep you close to nature and provide some enrichment; and who knows, one day you might catch the 'fever' again. Good Luck.
 
Dogwood; I feel your pain, man. I personally am not far from your position, also. This sport in the post 'Super Slam' era,has become riddled with cancer and is just waiting to die. Guys talk about our need for numbers, then jump on you like a pack of jackals smelling blood because you have tired of what this sport has become. It would be my guess that if Jack O'Conner came back to see the changes in this sport and the type of attitudes held by today's hunters, he would take up another sport, also. I'm sure there are other activities that one can pursue that will keep you close to nature and provide some enrichment; and who knows, one day you might catch the 'fever' again. Good Luck.
 
I do agree with him on some points, and mainly that our kids will not be able to do a lot of the hunting we have unless they have one hell of a good job. Things are getting pricey in the hunting world.
 
I do agree with him on some points, and mainly that our kids will not be able to do a lot of the hunting we have unless they have one hell of a good job. Things are getting pricey in the hunting world.
 
You do make a good point dogwood. Utah is one of the most expensive states to apply and has the highest tag fees for residents. Granted it has some of the best oppertunity for trophy Elk anywhere and one of the best trophy Mule Deer units in the world but they may as well call all the species once in a life time, becouse for most, once in your life time is all you are getting if your lucky.

Don't give up dogwood, just move to Wyoming or Montana, there you can hunt Elk for $45 and Deer for $30 as a resident,(Wyoming) all over the counter with no combination or hunting tag fee.

Once I retire, I am done with Utah as well, then all of you Utards odds can go up some more, after all thats all you care about!
 
You do make a good point dogwood. Utah is one of the most expensive states to apply and has the highest tag fees for residents. Granted it has some of the best oppertunity for trophy Elk anywhere and one of the best trophy Mule Deer units in the world but they may as well call all the species once in a life time, becouse for most, once in your life time is all you are getting if your lucky.

Don't give up dogwood, just move to Wyoming or Montana, there you can hunt Elk for $45 and Deer for $30 as a resident,(Wyoming) all over the counter with no combination or hunting tag fee.

Once I retire, I am done with Utah as well, then all of you Utards odds can go up some more, after all thats all you care about!
 
He's right. first post is spot on. Auction tags are HORSE$HIT and will be the death of it. Selling game that belongs to everyone should be criminal.
 
He's right. first post is spot on. Auction tags are HORSE$HIT and will be the death of it. Selling game that belongs to everyone should be criminal.
 

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ixsolracxi
ixsolracxi

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