Helping Our Deer Numbers

slamdunk

slamdunk

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I wanted to start a separate thread to discuss ideas, thoughts and visions on where we would like to see our acceptable deer numbers and how we can collectively achieve some success in this.

I'll start by saying "Do not even mention weapon restrictions, I am talking about DEER not Bucks."

It's no secret I am pro Conservation as a member of the MDF's High Desert Leadership Team.
I joined and became active because I wanted to see first hand where the money goes and I also wanted to be active in putting it there.

Collaring studies-
These studies are imperative to help us understand the challenges our deer face because of Urban Sprawl, getting to and from the wintering grounds and help us help them get there, as well as discovering CWD.

Collaring predators-
This information helps us better see and understand the impacts of predators on our deer.
I also support the OTC lion tags.
Even though it's rare to see a lion without using dogs, even killing one cat by a random hunter saves around 30 deer a year (conservative).

More fencing and crossing projects-
These don't save all deer from getting hit, but they definitely help from dispersing deer all over the various high traffic areas.
We can't forbid deer from getting to feed and water, but we can direct them in safer places to cross.
There are more fencing projects scheduled in the books.

Winter Feeding-
Although very controversial, I do believe it has it's place and is at least a feel good attempt.

Habitat Projects-
Absolutely yes, especially on winter ranges.
The biggest factor to success here is moisture.
Pray for rain, but continue restorations.

Depredation Hunts-
I absolutely hate these.
Two years ago one rancher near Torrey killed approximately a hundred deer in one single night with an AR-15 because they were in his hay.
If half of those were pregnant Does, the damage is unfathomable.
Figure out a plan to use Expo and Conservation dollars to compensate ranchers and or help fence the hay to keep the deer out.
We cannot afford to keep losing our pregnant Does.
I would like to see some huge improvements here.

Thoughts, input and suggestions?
Go.....
 
I’ll pile on to the winter feeding portion. I’ve never agreed with the resistance to winter feed. You don’t have to worry about CWD it the deer starve to death anyway. Also, by having feed areas you can better control where animals congregate over several years by consistently feeding in lower traffic areas away from highways and higher population areas. Hardware ranch up in cache valley is a good example.
 
Don't neglect the summer range.
Deer thrive in early successional habitat. In the absence of logging, pre 1930s grazing practices and with modern fire suppression the deer aren't as effective in gaining weight.
Fat deer survive winter better even if the winter range is suboptimal.
Large scale prescribed fire at higher elevations would be great.
 
slamdunk said:
I wanted to start a separate thread to discuss ideas, thoughts and visions on where we would like to see our acceptable deer numbers and how we can collectively achieve some success in this.

I'll start by saying "Do not even mention weapon restrictions, I am talking about DEER not Bucks."

It's no secret I am pro Conservation as a member of the MDF's High Desert Leadership Team.
I joined and became active because I wanted to see first hand where the money goes and I also wanted to be active in putting it there.

Collaring studies-
These studies are imperative to help us understand the challenges our deer face because of Urban Sprawl, getting to and from the wintering grounds and help us help them get there, as well as discovering CWD.

Collaring predators-
This information helps us better see and understand the impacts of predators on our deer.
I also support the OTC lion tags.
Even though it's rare to see a lion without using dogs, even killing one cat by a random hunter saves around 30 deer a year (conservative).

More fencing and crossing projects-
These don't save all deer from getting hit, but they definitely help from dispersing deer all over the various high traffic areas.
We can't forbid deer from getting to feed and water, but we can direct them in safer places to cross.
There are more fencing projects scheduled in the books.

Winter Feeding-
Although very controversial, I do believe it has it's place and is at least a feel good attempt.

Habitat Projects-
Absolutely yes, especially on winter ranges.
The biggest factor to success here is moisture.
Pray for rain, but continue restorations.

Depredation Hunts-
I absolutely hate these.
Two years ago one rancher near Torrey killed approximately a hundred deer in one single night with an AR-15 because they were in his hay.
If half of those were pregnant Does, the damage is unfathomable.
Figure out a plan to use Expo and Conservation dollars to compensate ranchers and or help fence the hay to keep the deer out.
We cannot afford to keep losing our pregnant Does.
I would like to see some huge improvements here.

Thoughts, input and suggestions?
Go.....
Click to expand...
Preach Slam, this is one area me and you are 100% in agreement.

Might I add cheat grass suppression, there has been some good research done showing how much of a negative impact cheat grass has on the range.
 
JakeH said:
Preach Slam, this is one area me and you are 100% in agreement.

Might I add cheat grass suppression, there has been some good research done showing how much of a negative impact cheat grass has on the range.
Click to expand...
Cheat grass was invented by the Devil himself, no doubt.

I'll never understand why it grows so rampant after a burn.
Why wasn't it there to begin with if the seeds were obviously already there?
Does anyone have an answer for this?
 
slamdunk said:
Cheat grass was invented by the Devil himself, no doubt.

I'll never understand why it grows so rampant after a burn.
Why wasn't it there to begin with if the seeds were obviously already there?
Does anyone have an answer for this?
Click to expand...
😂😂😂😂😂
 
slamdunk said:
Cheat grass was invented by the Devil himself, no doubt.

I'll never understand why it grows so rampant after a burn.
Why wasn't it there to begin with if the seeds were obviously already there?
Does anyone have an answer for this?
Click to expand...
It's already there.
Hard to find any BLM ground without at least some. If the site is already occupied by native vegetation or a cultivated grass (crested wheatgrass) then there is limited expression of the cheatgrass.
Once there is a disturbance like fire the existing seeds of cheatgrass will germinate before anything else and occupy the site. - hence the name CHEATgrass.
 
mtnrunner260 said:
It's already there.
Hard to find any BLM ground without at least some. If the site is already occupied by native vegetation or a cultivated grass (crested wheatgrass) then there is limited expression of the cheatgrass.
Once there is a disturbance like fire the existing seeds of cheatgrass will germinate before anything else and occupy the site. - hence the name CHEATgrass.
Click to expand...
Great insight.
So does that mean in time, probably a very long time, the devils weeds will eventually be over powered by later germination of valuable vegetation?

In a nutshell, if the noxious seeds were already there, they have had to of emerged at some previous point in time, yes, no?
 
slamdunk said:
Great insight.
So does that mean in time, probably a very long time, the devils weeds will eventually be over powered by later germination of valuable vegetation?

In a nutshell, if the noxious seeds were already there, they have had to of emerged at some previous point in time, yes, no?
Click to expand...
Yes, over time desirable vegetation can replace cheatgrass unless a new disturbance resets the clock. Not necessarily the later germination but same result.

Cheatgrass is not native and is not spread over the entire western landscape, just most of it. It has small seeds that can be transported short distance by wind and long distance by birds, animals and humans. It is native to the Mongolian Steppe.
It's competitive advantage can be reduced with targeted grazing, herbicides and other chemical treatments.

Deer do eat it in the spring and fall when it's green. I postulate that a calorie is not a calorie though. Deer eating cheatgrass vs bitterbrush is like me eating snickers vs a steak. -I am unaware of any peer reviewed research coving this though.
 
Genuine question, have the CWMUs had any tag or season reductions? I’ve always understood that October is one of the toughest times to hunt deer, but that only seems to apply to the public land. If guys are rifle hunting from August through January, that has an impact on the overall heard, especially on the smaller units.
 
Without a doubt, the most bang for the buck is fencing.

We can have all the habitat in the world, but that damn salt in winter, or green shoots across the highway, is just to tempting.

Hunters are tax payers. There should never be another section of freeway/ highway build or rebuild that doesn't include 10 ft fence in the bid.

6, 40, 84,89 I-15 from begining to end. Then branch out.

No hunter, or cat is killing what roads do.
 
I Agree!

How Many Decades Did It Take To Figure This Issue Out?

I Went Across Part Of 6 & 89 Today!

The Major Road Slaughters Haven't Started YET!



hossblur said:
Without a doubt, the most bang for the buck is fencing.

We can have all the habitat in the world, but that damn salt in winter, or green shoots across the highway, is just to tempting.

Hunters are tax payers. There should never be another section of freeway/ highway build or rebuild that doesn't include 10 ft fence in the bid.

6, 40, 84,89 I-15 from begining to end. Then branch out.

No hunter, or cat is killing what roads do.
Click to expand...
 
I haven't seen recent numbers but have heard ~20K for annual roadkill totals. Adding in the majority are pregnant does. Also USU had a grad student study how many died out of the median. Dont know those numbers but it was significant.
hossblur is right.
Keeping conservatively 30K deer a year vs arguing over what power scope 5K are killed...
 
hossblur said:
Without a doubt, the most bang for the buck is fencing.

We can have all the habitat in the world, but that damn salt in winter, or green shoots across the highway, is just to tempting.

Hunters are tax payers. There should never be another section of freeway/ highway build or rebuild that doesn't include 10 ft fence in the bid.

6, 40, 84,89 I-15 from begining to end. Then branch out.

No hunter, or cat is killing what roads do.
Click to expand...
Well said Hoss and 100% right
 
slamdunk said:
I'll start by saying "Do not even mention weapon restrictions, I am talking about DEER not Bucks.


Depredation Hunts-
I absolutely hate these.
Two years ago one rancher near Torrey killed approximately a hundred deer in one single night with an AR-15 because they were in his hay.
If half of those were pregnant Does, the damage is unfathomable.
Figure out a plan to use Expo and Conservation dollars to compensate ranchers and or help fence the hay to keep the deer out.
We cannot afford to keep losing our pregnant Does.
I would like to see some huge improvements here.

Thoughts, input and suggestions?
Go.....
Click to expand...
What are you @slamdunk some kind of liberal? What does it matter what gun was used in killing 100 deer? Two years ago alfalfa was $400 ton, in a drought nobody had much hay. Why would a rancher just let what little he has be ate up by deer? Did he have this problem in years past or is this a new thing? No need to study urban sprawl we all know what is happening, expo and conservation dollars only going to big ranches for big money clients.
 
I have decided to join the MDF. I just want to be assured an acceptable percentage of money is put on the ground for habitat.

I disagree the fencing is so great for the game since it disrupts their movements and migrating paterns that have been in place for decades if not centuries. They will only be controlled to a certain extent. However, I am sure it reduces collisions and I really don’t like the thought of a deer coming through my windshield.
 
Betterluckythangood said:
I have decided to join the MDF. I just want to be assured an acceptable percentage of money is put on the ground for habitat.

I disagree the fencing is so great for the game since it disrupts their movements and migrating paterns that have been in place for decades if not centuries. They will only be controlled to a certain extent. However, I am sure it reduces collisions and I really don’t like the thought of a deer coming through my windshield.
Click to expand...
The fencing is designed to just reroute the game to and from migration corridors, not prohibiting them from getting there.
This is what the collaring is for, tracking movements.
 
UtyoteKiller said:
What are you @slamdunk some kind of liberal? What does it matter what gun was used in killing 100 deer? Two years ago alfalfa was $400 ton, in a drought nobody had much hay. Why would a rancher just let what little he has be ate up by deer? Did he have this problem in years past or is this a new thing? No need to study urban sprawl we all know what is happening, expo and conservation dollars only going to big ranches for big money clients.
Click to expand...
You're right, I just should have said "high capacity rifle to quickly dispatch as many deer as possible."
Sorry you're so sensitive 🥺
 
Anyone know if the Eagle Mountain Deer crossing been successful?
This crossing is the one using decoys to bring Deer to the desired crossing area and then motion sensors light up when a real Deer is about to cross to warn drivers to be extra alert.

Expo: No other state has one. If we want to keep this going it needs to be turned over to the state and 100% of the money raised from our stolen tags goes back to the Fish and Wildlife.
 
MrShane said:
Anyone know if the Eagle Mountain Deer crossing been successful?
This crossing is the one using decoys to bring Deer to the desired crossing area and then motion sensors light up when a real Deer is about to cross to warn drivers to be extra alert.

Expo: No other state has one. If we want to keep this going it needs to be turned over to the state and 100% of the money raised from our stolen tags goes back to the Fish and Wildlife.
Click to expand...
I have put a lot of personal hours in on that habitat restoration there up on the hill, I'll ask our coordinator about the results of the actual crossing.
 
MrShane said:
Anyone know if the Eagle Mountain Deer crossing been successful?
This crossing is the one using decoys to bring Deer to the desired crossing area and then motion sensors light up when a real Deer is about to cross to warn drivers to be extra alert.

Expo: No other state has one. If we want to keep this going it needs to be turned over to the state and 100% of the money raised from our stolen tags goes back to the Fish and Wildlife.
Click to expand...
I doubt the dwr would see much of that Money if it went to the state for it would just go in the state coffers and be spent on whatever they wanted to spend it on
 
Cheatgrass seed can be dormant for 5 years and still germinate.

slamdunk said:
Great insight.
So does that mean in time, probably a very long time, the devils weeds will eventually be over powered by later germination of valuable vegetation?

In a nutshell, if the noxious seeds were already there, they have had to of emerged at some previous point in time, yes, no?
Click to expand...
 
slamdunk said:
The fencing is designed to just reroute the game to and from migration corridors, not prohibiting them from getting there.
This is what the collaring is for, tracking movements.
Click to expand...
I can appreciate the rerouting theory but how is any deer, elk or moose supposed to cross I80 in Parleys northward or southward if they didn’t get the memo about the crossing at the top?

I am just saying don’t go overboard with the fencing.
 
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MrShane said:
Anyone know if the Eagle Mountain Deer crossing been successful?
This crossing is the one using decoys to bring Deer to the desired crossing area and then motion sensors light up when a real Deer is about to cross to warn drivers to be extra alert.

Expo: No other state has one. If we want to keep this going it needs to be turned over to the state and 100% of the money raised from our stolen tags goes back to the Fish and Wildlife.
Click to expand...
I drive that area daily, and it is working well. There’s been a couple road kills so far this year, but it’s a fraction of what it was in the past.
 
dgwoody said:
Genuine question, have the CWMUs had any tag or season reductions? I’ve always understood that October is one of the toughest times to hunt deer, but that only seems to apply to the public land. If guys are rifle hunting from August through January, that has an impact on the overall heard, especially on the smaller units.
Click to expand...
No one is hunting deer with rifles in August, or January, or even December. Cwmu seasons for antlered deer run from sep 1 to Oct 31, or sep 15 to November 10. I know at least one large cwmu in the north has had their November season taken away.
 
Wbrim said:
I drive that area daily, and it is working well. There’s been a couple road kills so far this year, but it’s a fraction of what it was in the past.
Click to expand...
Hard to determine if the fencing is working or there are just a ton less critters?
 
This is the topic we need to be 100% focused on. If we had the deer we wouldn’t be trying to change every damn hunting rule annually.

I have no expertise in this field.

Cheat grass is the Phragmite of the mountains. Aggressive seeding after fires… could that help?

I 100% support collar studies to isolate the best crossing locations across our worst collision zones. Then, fencing them.

We also need to find a way to raise the population objectives (for elk). This will require an agreement with the cattlemen. This would cut cow tags and bring our herds back to what they were 10 years ago when they were severely over population.

Stop killing does and cow moose. Period.

How about on our WMA’s we plant some winter range food plots for deer and elk to pull them off the private fields and away from roads?

Aggressive predator control during fawning/calving seasons and in severe winters.

These are just some thoughts outa my simple mind.
 
Silentstalker said:
This is the topic we need to be 100% focused on. If we had the deer we wouldn’t be trying to change every damn hunting rule annually.

I have no expertise in this field.

Cheat grass is the Phragmite of the mountains. Aggressive seeding after fires… could that help?

I 100% support collar studies to isolate the best crossing locations across our worst collision zones. Then, fencing them.

We also need to find a way to raise the population objectives (for elk). This will require an agreement with the cattlemen. This would cut cow tags and bring our herds back to what they were 10 years ago when they were severely over population.

Stop killing does and cow moose. Period.
Click to expand...
I Totally Agree With You On Not Killing Does & Cow Moose!

How Many Surplus Moose Do They Think We Have Left In This State?

JUDAS!



Silentstalker said:
How about on our WMA’s we plant some winter range food plots for deer and elk to pull them off the private fields and away from roads?

Aggressive predator control during fawning/calving seasons and in severe winters.

These are just some thoughts outa my simple mind.
Click to expand...
 
yoteduster said:
I doubt the dwr would see much of that Money if it went to the state for it would just go in the state coffers and be spent on whatever they wanted to spend it on
Click to expand...
Use legislative action to make sure the money goes back to our big game,
Or,
Just get back the stolen tags and returned to the public draw where they belong to slow point creep.
 
ridgetops said:
It's very minimal west of I-15, except for the pine valley unit.
Click to expand...
I’d beg to differ, it’s pretty ugly in spots with high densities if you open your eyes, and if it is minimal there’s a reason (no deer) perhaps cause a lot were all killed on the road
 
Fencing on the Manti. I think a lot of units get overlooked when it comes to projects. I am convinced that this would do wonders if done right. I know a section that is probably 6 miles that would save a lot of deer each year. There are so many landowners involved I am assuming that would be an issue you would have to work through.
 
Im not sure the fencing works, we had the fencing between Monticello and Blanding that was killing close to 500 deer a year. the project has been done for 5+ years now and there hasn't been an increase in deer population, actually it seems less. You would think with as many deer that highway was killing within 5 years our deer herd would be growing so rapidly that we would have to implement some doe hunts.
 
SS! said:
I like the fence idea. If you high fence the whole state of Utah and not let anyone leave the mule deer population will surely climb in ID NV AZ WY and CO.

Let’s sacrifice one state for the better of all!!
Click to expand...
So, I'm guessing us tards are pretty lethal? ;)
 
ridgetops said:
Can you be specific?
Click to expand...
Near oak city, in between Lyndyll and eureka, and worst I’ve seen is just east outside of leamington, in the wintertime at least 3 or 4 get killed per week on that little stretch where they cross from field to field, adds up quick
 
SanPitch said:
Near oak city, in between Lyndyll and eureka, and worst I’ve seen is just east outside of leamington, in the wintertime at least 3 or 4 get killed per week on that little stretch where they cross from field to field, adds up quick
Click to expand...
Thanks. I personally would consider the stretch between lynndl and eureka to be minimal. I travel it a fair amount and rarely see road kill deer. I've seen the blinking deer crossing signs between lynndyl and lemingron , so there must be an issue with deer crossing there but I don't drive that road in the winter, so I don't have an opinion on that stretch. I doubt the dwr will fence an area " between fields".
 
ridgetops said:
Thanks. I personally would consider the stretch between lynndl and eureka to be minimal. I travel it a fair amount and rarely see road kill deer. I've seen the blinking deer crossing signs between lynndyl and lemingron , so there must be an issue with deer crossing there but I don't drive that road in the winter, so I don't have an opinion on that stretch. I doubt the dwr will fence an area " between fields".
Click to expand...
That stretch you drive is definitely way less, but yes I drive near leamington very often and it is super bad mainly between leamington and the cement plant, dodged two fresh kills in the road yesterday morning, I agree fencing is probably not an option for some places but I think it would be very beneficial to have lower speed limits or something for small stretches like that where all the deer are getting hit on just a short 1-2 mile stretch, instead of people going 80 rushing to work through there
 
SS! said:
I like the fence idea. If you high fence the whole state of Utah and not let anyone leave the mule deer population will surely climb in ID NV AZ WY and CO.

Let’s sacrifice one state for the better of all!!
Click to expand...

Pretty good effort right there 🤣
 
But, you should think that through carefully.

If you fence in Utah, who will put the ladies through rehab over at the rub and tugs in Rock Springs, Laramie, or Cheyenne. Not sure taking ebt cards from the locals will cover the Narcan, let alone halfway house
 
I Did See A HOT Chick In Wyoming Once!

She Was From Alaska!

hossblur said:
But, you should think that through carefully.

If you fence in Utah, who will put the ladies through rehab over at the rub and tugs in Rock Springs, Laramie, or Cheyenne. Not sure taking ebt cards from the locals will cover the Narcan, let alone halfway house
Click to expand...
 
slamdunk said:
I wanted to start a separate thread to discuss ideas, thoughts and visions on where we would like to see our acceptable deer numbers and how we can collectively achieve some success in this.

I'll start by saying "Do not even mention weapon restrictions, I am talking about DEER not Bucks."

It's no secret I am pro Conservation as a member of the MDF's High Desert Leadership Team.
I joined and became active because I wanted to see first hand where the money goes and I also wanted to be active in putting it there.

Collaring studies-
These studies are imperative to help us understand the challenges our deer face because of Urban Sprawl, getting to and from the wintering grounds and help us help them get there, as well as discovering CWD.

Collaring predators-
This information helps us better see and understand the impacts of predators on our deer.
I also support the OTC lion tags.
Even though it's rare to see a lion without using dogs, even killing one cat by a random hunter saves around 30 deer a year (conservative).

More fencing and crossing projects-
These don't save all deer from getting hit, but they definitely help from dispersing deer all over the various high traffic areas.
We can't forbid deer from getting to feed and water, but we can direct them in safer places to cross.
There are more fencing projects scheduled in the books.

Winter Feeding-
Although very controversial, I do believe it has it's place and is at least a feel good attempt.

Habitat Projects-
Absolutely yes, especially on winter ranges.
The biggest factor to success here is moisture.
Pray for rain, but continue restorations.

Depredation Hunts-
I absolutely hate these.
Two years ago one rancher near Torrey killed approximately a hundred deer in one single night with an AR-15 because they were in his hay.
If half of those were pregnant Does, the damage is unfathomable.
Figure out a plan to use Expo and Conservation dollars to compensate ranchers and or help fence the hay to keep the deer out.
We cannot afford to keep losing our pregnant Does.
I would like to see some huge improvements here.

Thoughts, input and suggestions?
Go.....
Click to expand...
I'd agree with all of the above.

Fencing is desperately needed in many areas. I live off of Hwy 89 in the central part of the state and it's carnage annually in the winter. Last winter was extreme.

I'd also add in more water installations for when water is scarce on drought years. Let's not leave it to cattle ranchers alone. Build more wells and troughs and water catchments on the landscape.

From a conservation project standpoint, I'd love to see a LOT more of these. I've been in the dedicated hunter program for over a decade and even joined MDF 2 years ago, hoping to be able to get involved in more projects that would benefit mule deer. And I haven't seen hardly any as of late! Seems like folks are more interested in hosting golf events or raffles or passing out fishing proclamations from my experience. Lots of talk and not a lot of organized opportunities to help out.
 
copple2 said:
I'd agree with all of the above.

Fencing is desperately needed in many areas. I live off of Hwy 89 in the central part of the state and it's carnage annually in the winter. Last winter was extreme.

I'd also add in more water installations for when water is scarce on drought years. Let's not leave it to cattle ranchers alone. Build more wells and troughs and water catchments on the landscape.

From a conservation project standpoint, I'd love to see a LOT more of these. I've been in the dedicated hunter program for over a decade and even joined MDF 2 years ago, hoping to be able to get involved in more projects that would benefit mule deer. And I haven't seen hardly any as of late! Seems like folks are more interested in hosting golf events or raffles or passing out fishing proclamations from my experience. Lots of talk and not a lot of organized opportunities to help out.
Click to expand...
Do you follow any of the MDF social media pages by chance?
Every project and event that needs public help are posted.

And in honesty, there weren't a lot of small local projects this year as in previous years because of the heavy spring snows and lack of access.

Having said that, there have been many big projects all over the state as anyone can see on the WRI website.

I do like your enthusiasm and positive outlook, if you'd be interested in joining a local committee as a member so you can better see and understand the workings of the inside, we'd love to have you.
PM me for more information.
 
slamdunk said:
Do you follow any of the MDF social media pages by chance?
Every project and event that needs public help are posted.

And in honesty, there weren't a lot of small local projects this year as in previous years because of the heavy spring snows and lack of access.

Having said that, there have been many big projects all over the state as anyone can see on the WRI website.

I do like your enthusiasm and positive outlook, if you'd be interested in joining a local committee as a member so you can better see and understand the workings of the inside, we'd love to have you.
PM me for more information.
Click to expand...
Just joined last night. I am not down with any fencing but will volunteer for water projects or habitat improvement. I will check out the FB page
 
slamdunk said:
Do you follow any of the MDF social media pages by chance?
Every project and event that needs public help are posted.

And in honesty, there weren't a lot of small local projects this year as in previous years because of the heavy spring snows and lack of access.

Having said that, there have been many big projects all over the state as anyone can see on the WRI website.

I do like your enthusiasm and positive outlook, if you'd be interested in joining a local committee as a member so you can better see and understand the workings of the inside, we'd love to have you.
PM me for more information.
Click to expand...
I do check the MDF Utah Facebook page occasionally. The last project I saw on there was from Dec of 2022, after the project had been completed.

I'm not familiar with the WRI website. Where do we find that?

I'll PM you as well @slamdunk
 
copple2 said:
I do check the MDF Utah Facebook page occasionally. The last project I saw on there was from Dec of 2022, after the project had been completed.

I'm not familiar with the WRI website. Where do we find that?

I'll PM you as well @slamdunk
Click to expand...

Utah's Watershed Restoration Initiative

Water Restoration Initiative run by DNR
wri.utah.gov wri.utah.gov

This site shows past, present and future projects funded by conservation dollars.
Once you figure out how to navigate around, it's kinda fun looking at.
 
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elkassassin said:
Cheat Grass Has Been An Issue Forever!

Anything Ever Been Even Tried To Help Eradicate It In DRATville?
Click to expand...
There are a lot of efforts to control cheatgrass. There are some newer herbicides that target it and other annual species. The trick is getting plants back that will compete with it. It will never be eradicated, but managing vegetation communities to have healthy amounts of perennial plants can keep it at bay.
 
@slamdunk what are the top ideas from the MDF to help the herds?

We are all a bunch of know it all passionate hunters - but, I would genuinely like to know what the experts in the mule deer world think in regards to reversing the ever plummeting mule deer herd.

I know elk have played a roll in this. What once was great habitat full of deer is full of elk and drastically reduced deer numbers.

It seems we have hammered the elk to get them at or under objective and the deer have not seemed to rebound.

How well have the PJ chaining projects worked? Have we seen increase in deer numbers in those areas?

What about guzzlers? Would more guzzlers help?

How successful have the fencing projects been in the past?

I’m hoping the MDF may have valuable insight to this topic?
 
Silentstalker said:
@slamdunk what are the top ideas from the MDF to help the herds?

We are all a bunch of know it all passionate hunters - but, I would genuinely like to know what the experts in the mule deer world think in regards to reversing the ever plummeting mule deer herd.

I know elk have played a roll in this. What once was great habitat full of deer is full of elk and drastically reduced deer numbers.

It seems we have hammered the elk to get them at or under objective and the deer have not seemed to rebound.

How well have the PJ chaining projects worked? Have we seen increase in deer numbers in those areas?

What about guzzlers? Would more guzzlers help?

How successful have the fencing projects been in the past?

I’m hoping the MDF may have valuable insight to this topic?
Click to expand...
Oh man, I could spend hours showing all the things the MDF is doing, it's pretty exciting.
Not sure if you were aware of the huge partnership that was announced at Expo last spring but the Forest Service and BLM paired up with MDF and are collectively allocating an additional 76 million dollars for various projects across the west for habitat improvements.
Here is a direct link:
muledeer.org

MDF Announces Major New Partnerships USFS and BLM

MDF announces expanded partnerships with USFS and the BLM, leveraging millions of dollars to implement deer habitat restoration projects.
muledeer.org muledeer.org

You are correct in saying Elk affect Mule Deer.
Although they don't always directly compete for the same food sources, they generally don't "thrive" well in the same shared areas and unfortunately it's the more fragile deer that loses it's place amongst the given landscape.
Finding balance is the key, but as we already know, moisture and habitat dictates that.

Chaining projects provide habitat growth to take place by clearing pockets of trees in dense areas where there is virtually no forage growing on the ground.
Some areas have had great success with these such as Paunsaugunt, Henry's and others where deer are often seen heavily feeding in these areas.
A concern I personally see in these is Cheat Grass growth over time.


Guzzlers are always a good thing, but the can only provide a drink to the animals whereas rain is needed to nourish the food sources.
We build a lot of guzzlers and many more are scheduled in the books.

Fencing has been very helpful in reducing highway mortality throughout many migration corridors.
It doesn't stop all incidents but it helps direct the game to cross roads in specific areas where they can be seen better by vehicles.
Unfortunately, speed is the major factor in today's collisions as vehicles are traveling at much higher speeds in today's world.
There are numerous capturing and collaring projects currently taking place to study travel routes and determine where to best use fencing and crossing to ensure safer travel routes to and from food and water sources and migration corridors.

Here is the link to the WRI where it provides past, present and future project information.

Utah's Watershed Restoration Initiative

Water Restoration Initiative run by DNR
wri.utah.gov wri.utah.gov

If you are on Instagram, another great conservation page funded by multiple groups including MDF is wildlifeprof.
They just posted an exciting post about the fawns that were collared earlier in the year.
They are fat, healthy and looking good going into winter.

I hope this helps answer some questions.
 
Last edited:
slamdunk said:
Oh man, I could spend hours showing all the things the MDF is doing, it's pretty exciting.
Not sure if you were aware of the huge partnership that was announced at Expo last spring but the Forest Service and BLM paired up with MDF and are collectively allocating an additional 76 million dollars for various projects across the west for habitat improvements.
Here is a direct link:
muledeer.org

MDF Announces Major New Partnerships USFS and BLM

MDF announces expanded partnerships with USFS and the BLM, leveraging millions of dollars to implement deer habitat restoration projects.
muledeer.org muledeer.org

You are correct in saying Elk affect Mule Deer.
Although they don't always directly compete for the same food sources, they generally don't "thrive" well in the same shared areas and unfortunately it's the more fragile deer that loses it's place amongst the given landscape.
Finding balance is the key, but as we already know, moisture and habitat dictates that.

Chaining projects provide habitat growth to take place by clearing pockets of trees in dense areas where there is virtually no forage growing on the ground.
Some areas have had great success with these such as Paunsaugunt, Henry's and others where deer are often seen heavily feeding in these areas.
A concern I personally see in these is Cheat Grass growth over time.


Guzzlers are always a good thing, but the can only provide a drink to the animals whereas rain is needed to nourish the food sources.
We build a lot of guzzlers and many more are scheduled in the books.

Fencing has been very helpful in reducing highway mortality throughout many migration corridors.
It doesn't stop all incidents but it helps direct the game to cross roads in specific areas where they can be seen better by vehicles.
Unfortunately, speed is the major factor in today's collisions as vehicles are traveling at much higher speeds in today's world.
There are numerous capturing and collaring projects currently taking place to study travel routes and determine where to best use fencing and crossing to ensure safer travel routes to and from food and water sources and migration corridors.

Here is the link to the WRI where it provides past, present and future project information.

Utah's Watershed Restoration Initiative

Water Restoration Initiative run by DNR
wri.utah.gov wri.utah.gov

If you are on Instagram, another great conservation page funded by multiple groups including MDF is wildlifeprof.
They just posted an exciting post about the fawns that were collared earlier in the year.
They are fat, healthy and looking good going into winter.

I hope this helps answer some questions.
Click to expand...
Thanks Slam! Those additional funds will be very welcomed.

Recently they were doing studies on deer transplants in Utah Do we know how they ended up? I know transplants are kind of frowned upon with deer but I think those studies at least initially showed higher survivability than expected.
 
slamdunk said:
I wanted to start a separate thread to discuss ideas, thoughts and visions on where we would like to see our acceptable deer numbers and how we can collectively achieve some success in this.

I'll start by saying "Do not even mention weapon restrictions, I am talking about DEER not Bucks."

It's no secret I am pro Conservation as a member of the MDF's High Desert Leadership Team.
I joined and became active because I wanted to see first hand where the money goes and I also wanted to be active in putting it there.

Collaring studies-
These studies are imperative to help us understand the challenges our deer face because of Urban Sprawl, getting to and from the wintering grounds and help us help them get there, as well as discovering CWD.

Collaring predators-
This information helps us better see and understand the impacts of predators on our deer.
I also support the OTC lion tags.
Even though it's rare to see a lion without using dogs, even killing one cat by a random hunter saves around 30 deer a year (conservative).

More fencing and crossing projects-
These don't save all deer from getting hit, but they definitely help from dispersing deer all over the various high traffic areas.
We can't forbid deer from getting to feed and water, but we can direct them in safer places to cross.
There are more fencing projects scheduled in the books.

Winter Feeding-
Although very controversial, I do believe it has it's place and is at least a feel good attempt.

Habitat Projects-
Absolutely yes, especially on winter ranges.
The biggest factor to success here is moisture.
Pray for rain, but continue restorations.

Depredation Hunts-
I absolutely hate these.
Two years ago one rancher near Torrey killed approximately a hundred deer in one single night with an AR-15 because they were in his hay.
If half of those were pregnant Does, the damage is unfathomable.
Figure out a plan to use Expo and Conservation dollars to compensate ranchers and or help fence the hay to keep the deer out.
We cannot afford to keep losing our pregnant Does.
I would like to see some huge improvements here.

Thoughts, input and suggestions?
Go.....
Click to expand...
Agree with with priority on more fencing and stop shooting does.
 

Scientists Warn American 'Promotion of Hunting' Is Ruining the Environment Sound like the tach should take this up​

 
Rangeland said:
There are a lot of efforts to control cheatgrass. There are some newer herbicides that target it and other annual species. The trick is getting plants back that will compete with it. It will never be eradicated, but managing vegetation communities to have healthy amounts of perennial plants can keep it at bay.
Click to expand...
Took these pics today on west side of Utah lake by gun range. Russion thistle and cheat grass where reasonably healthy sagebrush was twenty or thirty years ago. The first pic is frightening to me. I don’t think a field mouse could survive there, let alone a jack rabbit or deer.



6FF19DFB-0F71-418B-9687-03F16633C38A.jpeg


F55B57A7-F23F-497A-A672-6626019233E9.jpeg
 
Last edited:

wildlife overpass bridges​






By: Laura Polacheck
Posted at 11:25 AM, Dec 05, 2023

and last updated 11:55 AM, Dec 05, 2023
SALT LAKE CITY — Those animal crossing signs don't always prevent collisions with wildlife on the highway, but Utah will receive a $5.5 million grant from the U.S. Department of Transportation to build wildlife overpasses to protect potential collisions.
These bridges are part of a plan to restore populations of big game wildlife such as the Paunsaugunt mule deer.
Utah has several of these bridges, one the most popular being the one build in 2018 on I-80 in Parley's Canyon that streams video of beer, deer, cougars, and other wildlife using the thoroughfare.

Beer Huh?:D
 
I just noticed this post so thought I would chime in. I happen to have a "little" experience working on cheatgrass over the past 35+ years!

Here are a couple articles that may answer a couple questions. The first is a MD foundation article and the 2nd is an interesting article that may give land managers a feel for where to start battling cheatgrass problems in Idaho.

Sublette County Wyoming is a prime example of being proactive with "protecting intact core native communities from large-scale and severe cheatgrass invasion". Sublette County has been conducting large scale cheatgrass monitoring and spray programs longer than just about anyone in the Western US. There are other successful large scale operations that have been taking place on cheatgrass, ventenata, and medusahead in Sheridan County Wyoming.

It's exciting that the word is getting out and that it is possible to achieve long-term cheatgrass control that improves native shrub and forb habitat that ultimately benefits mule deer and other wildlife.

www.partnersinthesage.com

From the Inside Out: Local Cheatgrass Treatment Aids in Landscape-Scale Habitat Resiliency — Partners in the Sage

Partners in Central Idaho are addressing cheatgrass and other invasive annual grasses to help protect core sagebrush habitat across the region.
www.partnersinthesage.com www.partnersinthesage.com

www.nrcs.usda.gov

The Cheatgrass Challenge - Idaho | Natural Resources Conservation Service

Cheatgrass and other invasive annual grasses, such as, medusahead and ventenata, are taking over America’s sagebrush rangelands, increasing wildfire size and frequency, reducing forage productivity, and threatening wildlife habitat and rural economies.
www.nrcs.usda.gov www.nrcs.usda.gov


 
jims said:
I just noticed this post so thought I would chime in. I happen to have a "little" experience working on cheatgrass over the past 35+ years!

Here are a couple articles that may answer a couple questions. The first is a MD foundation article and the 2nd is an interesting article that may give land managers a feel for where to start battling cheatgrass problems in Idaho.

Sublette County Wyoming is a prime example of being proactive with "protecting intact core native communities from large-scale and severe cheatgrass invasion". Sublette County has been conducting large scale cheatgrass monitoring and spray programs longer than just about anyone in the Western US. There are other successful large scale operations that have been taking place on cheatgrass, ventenata, and medusahead in Sheridan County Wyoming.

It's exciting that the word is getting out and that it is possible to achieve long-term cheatgrass control that improves native shrub and forb habitat that ultimately benefits mule deer and other wildlife.

www.partnersinthesage.com

From the Inside Out: Local Cheatgrass Treatment Aids in Landscape-Scale Habitat Resiliency — Partners in the Sage

Partners in Central Idaho are addressing cheatgrass and other invasive annual grasses to help protect core sagebrush habitat across the region.
www.partnersinthesage.com www.partnersinthesage.com

www.nrcs.usda.gov

The Cheatgrass Challenge - Idaho | Natural Resources Conservation Service

Cheatgrass and other invasive annual grasses, such as, medusahead and ventenata, are taking over America’s sagebrush rangelands, increasing wildfire size and frequency, reducing forage productivity, and threatening wildlife habitat and rural economies.
www.nrcs.usda.gov www.nrcs.usda.gov


Click to expand...
Great info Jim’s but @slamdunk has the attention span of a goldfish
 

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