I just figured out 440...

manny53

Long Time Member
Messages
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LAST EDITED ON Feb-07-12 AT 09:49AM (MST)[p]what Is The Alinsky Method? is it Being Used To Destroy Our Freedoms Albert V. Burns
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The education establishment in this country, at all levels, continually decries the absence of parental involvement in the everyday process of educating the young people of this country. We are asked to volunteer time to ease the burdens on the teachers. We are NOT expected to assume that we will have any input into decisions effecting what they will be taught or how the teaching process is to be done.

In the book, "Educating For The New World Order," the author, Bev Eakman points out repeatedly the necessity of the educationists to preserve the ILLUSION that there is: "Lay, or community, participation in the decision making process, while in fact lay citizens are being squeezed out."

It is interesting, and EXTREMELY important to Americans, both as parents and as citizens, to clearly understand just HOW the "squeezing out" process takes place. It is a well defined, if not well perceived, process known as the "Alinsky Method" (which was derived from a procedure named as "The Delphi Technique.") This method of manipulating people is based on the fact that people in groups tend to share a common knowledge base and display certain identifiable characteristics known as "group dynamics."

In this process, one or more people known as "Change Agents" or "Facilitators" appear to be acting as organizers, "allowing" each person in the group to express their concerns about some program or policy under consideration. While this process is going on, people are urged to make lists or form into task forces. The Facilitator carefully notes which members of the group are leaders, which are "loud mouths" and which may be easily swayed to different viewpoints.

At a certain point, the previously friendly Change Agent begins to act as "devil?s advocate," becoming an agitator. The process involves playing one part of the group against another, the "divide and conquer" technique. Anyone who is not clearly in accord with the Facilitator?s agenda is made to appear ridiculous, inarticulate, ignorant or dogmatic. The idea is to make these members of the group angry thus escalating tensions. The end object being to shut opposition voices out of the group.

The "targets" of such manipulation rarely, if ever, realize how they are being manipulated. If they do suspect, they generally have no idea how to defeat the process.

This method is being used at all levels of government to force meetings toward PRESET conclusions. There are three steps to defeating this process. They are simple to learn, if not always easy to put into practice since the Facilitators are well trained in agitation techniques.

The first rule is: Always be charming, pleasant and courteous. SMILE! Speak in a normal voice to avoid seeming to be belligerent or aggressive.

Rule No. 2 is to STAY FOCUSED! Write your question or statement down in advance to help you stay on track. These Change Agents are trained to twist the conversation around to make the questioner appear foolish or belligerent or aggressive. The idea being to put the questioner on the defensive. Be careful! As mentioned in Rule 1, always be charming, pleasant and courteous (if it kills you to do so!) Often an attempt will be made to change the subject, digress or distort your intent. Always bring them back to the question you asked! If they distort your question into what amounts to an accusation of them, simply state clearly and precisely: "That is NOT what I stated. What I asked was..."(here repeat your original question.) Do not be distracted or angered by their efforts to make you look bad.

Rule No. 3: BE PERSISTENT! When the Facilitator realizes that putting you on the defensive is not going to work, quite often he, or she, will go into some long drawn out discussion of some unrelated or only vaguely related subject. Such a discussion may drag on for a number of minutes. The intent being to have the crowd become bored and forget what the original question was. Let them run on, then very calmly, quietly but with determination drag them back to the subject by saying: "But you didn't answer my question! My question was..."(again repeat your question.)

Never, NEVER allow yourself to become angry. Anger directed toward the Change Agent makes him or her the victim. Their object is to become liked by the crowd, to be seen as a friend by a majority of those present to convince that majority the ideas of the Facilitator are correct and acceptable.

With the increasing demand for education reform, increasing agitation among the public and more and more grassroots research exposing the defects in our current government indoctrination centers, also known as public schools, more and more people are being exposed to this Alinsky method of maneuvering public meetings toward preset goals. Somehow, people walk out of public meetings wondering just what happened - how were their ideas and objections so neatly derailed. This consistent pattern of manipulation of public meetings is causing concern about the corruption of the very process of government established by our Founding Fathers.

Next week we will examine some of the finer points of the Delphi Technique, how and why it was originally developed and how it is being used to destroy our freedoms.
 
Alinsky died of a sudden, massive heart attack in 1972, on a street corner in Carmel, California, at the age of 63. Two months previously, he discussed life after death in his interview with Playboy:[4]

ALINSKY: ... if there is an afterlife, and I have anything to say about it, I will unreservedly choose to go to hell.
PLAYBOY: Why?
ALINSKY: Hell would be heaven for me. All my life I've been with the have-nots. Over here, if you're a have-not, you're short of dough. If you're a have-not in hell, you're short of virtue. Once I get into hell, I'll start organizing the have-nots over there.
PLAYBOY: Why them?
ALINSKY: They're my kind of people.
 
You're having quite a conversation with yourself Manny.


Maybe I just enjoy irritating wingnuts more than watching reality shows on tv.









Stay thirsty my friends
 
like rick santorum said, universities and colleges are indoctrinating our youth with this crap.......couldn't agree with him more.
 
College Campus? try 1st thru 12th grade,it use to be see ##### run,now it's see ##### with boyfriend.I'm talken CA.
 
To lump all as one is to simplistic. I'm sure Liberty University, and Bryan college, Oral Roberts University fundamentalist Universities are as quite different politically than Cal. Berkley. Santorum is looking for the Fundamental vote I'm sure everyone on here has that figured out.

If we are talking about K-12 education that varies more than you can imagine from state to state. It is absolutely silly to blanket statement all as Santorum did.
 
That's why I said California,most people I talk to when I am in another State are unaware of the teachings here in CA.
 
I attended a very conservative college in a very conservative state almost 15 years ago. Most the graduates were conservative, yet I had a slew of liberal professors trying to spread there liberal BS. There were plenty of student/professor confrontations. Philosophy teachers are the worst. In addition, they are biggest waste of tax payer dollars and students time and frankly they use the classrooms of america to spread their radical ideas. Even if you are a conservative professor or teacher, most of the study texts are written by liberals. I would imagine it has only gotton worse over the last decade.
 
So you were able to figure out for yourself what you thought and believed but today's youth are just pawns of the liberal elite?

Nemont
 
I'm going to ask again, if the conservatives hate the evil liberal teachers so much why aren't there more conservative teachers? if we make NASCAR a required class would that draw them in?






Stay thirsty my friends
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-07-12 AT 04:45PM (MST)[p]I know alot of conservative educators.



Nemont
 
I'm a moderate although not so much on this site, where I look more like a flaming liberal. See that's the thing about labels it alters perspective according to the group you're compared to. I taught my own children how to think not what to think. I try to do the same thing in the classroom. I feel its important to have liberal as well as conservative professors to get input from both sides. The ability to consider both sides an evaluate both sides is why I frequent this forum.

I teach a 12th grade government class that includes a kid more conservative and religious than Manny and several girls that are more liberal than Piper. Many things about government are debated. If they were all the same much of the value of the class would be lost. They are all learning and thinking about what they and the U.S. will become. Discussion can be lead by a teacher and I'll occasionally interject my opinion. In the society we live in today they read and look at so much on the internet and other news sources they eventually develop their own political philosophy. If I did have that much power to get kids to think only my way I'd start a cult get rich and hunt the rest of my life.
 
It's just another excuse for wingnuts to excuse their failures.

If they knew how to read they'd teach their kids themselves rather than send them to liberal teachers in a socialist education system.









Stay thirsty my friends
 
>I'm going to ask again,
>if the conservatives hate the
>evil liberal teachers so much
>why aren't there more conservative
>teachers? if we make
>NASCAR a required class would
>that draw them in?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Stay thirsty my friends


who you fooling, they're there but to keep their jobs they're forced to silence and to comply with the status Quo...

I've seen ?em bullied to silence also....but you wouldn't believe it anyways...
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-07-12 AT 07:57PM (MST)[p]
>I know alot of conservative educators.
>
>
>
>
>Nemont


maybe in Montana but in general they may be conservative but they're bullied into silencing their view to comply with the liberal education system so they can retain their job...

Lately Ne? you seem like a bully, you seem to attack more then converse these days, just my two bits tis all?
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-07-12 AT 08:03PM (MST)[p]If the personal freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution inhibit the government's ability to govern the people, we should look to limit those guarantees. --Bill Clinton in an August 12, 1993 speech?

Give me four years to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted" --Vladimir I Lenin.

"Give us the child for 8 years and it will be a Bolshevik forever" ---Vladimir I Lenin.

These beliefs are imbedded in the hearts and minds of the liberal progressives many of whom are on the Obamma team, if you remember Clinton visited Russia as a youth...
 
If you wrap your head twice in tin foil it will stop the voices manny. It will also stop the government from stealing your brain waves. Its all a big conspiracy.


I knew it would catch up to you guys that were doing acid in the high school bathrooms in the late 1960's and early 70's. Remember the films they showed us? Manny you should have listened.
 
>Give me four years to teach
>the children and the seed
>I have sown will never
>be uprooted" --Vladimir I Lenin.
>
>
>"Give us the child for 8
>years and it will be
>a Bolshevik forever" ---Vladimir I
>Lenin.
>


Manny, this is how religion works. (hint: Sunday school)
 
Yeah but that's good brainwashing.



religious-brainwashing-hatedandloved-demotivational-poster-1275487236.jpg
















Stay thirsty my friends
 
>maybe in Montana but in general
>they may be conservative but
>they're bullied into silencing their
>view to comply with the
>liberal education system so they
>can retain their job...
>
>Lately Ne? you seem like a
>bully, you seem to attack
>more then converse these days,
>just my two bits tis
>all?


Well I guess you will have to tell my wife that she is being bullied into silence. She is way conservative and seems to be able to let her views be known just fine.

As me being a bully or attacking, I am tired of all the fake conservatives on here that are only conservative when it comes to other's piece of the government pie but have no problem getting their own welfare. I am also tired of the religous piety on here that paints the world as black and white, us against them, they are wrong we are right kind of attitude displayed.

My two bits is that the level of discussion on here is very, very stupid most days and it is more for my own entertainment to poke people because most don't think very deeply about anything.

If you are worried about what is said on an internet hunting forum then probably you shouldn't post.

Nemont
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-08-12 AT 09:02AM (MST)[p]again when you libs are pushed with the facts that you distort you resort to mocking....it gets old and you've been found wanting...

it's a fact Alinsky lived its a fact that he was a rebel its a fact that many libs adhere to his mindset and its a fact people like Obamma think like him...

Saul Alinsky in his own words:

?Lest we forget at least an over-the-shoulder acknowledgment to the very first radical: from all our legends, mythology, and history... the first radical known to man who rebelled against the establishment and did it so effectively that he at least won his own kingdom ? Lucifer.? (Saul Alinsky's dedication of his book "Rules for radicals")

Corny' keep those blinders on you may not be able to sleep at night should you see the truth...
 
I could just as easily and more accurately say you think just like Torquemada.

I have no superstition or agenda to follow. I see what I think is right and follow that path, maybe I'm not always right but I get by just fine. if I am a follower of anyone's teachings it's Teddy Roosevelt.






Stay thirsty my friends
 
my question is what makes you think today's youth are any different than you? You went to college and figured out for yourself what you believed or didn't believe. How is it any different today?

Nemont
 
manny you can never figure out my friend 440 he is a riddle wrapped in an enigma and tied with a cryptogram.




"I'll admit it, that's hella funny! Good to see you around 202, I wish you would return on a regular basis there's a lot of bruised low lying fruit on here lately. You should be on here on a regular basis especially since it was your political carpet bombing at the campfire that inspired this forum!"
Thank you Forthewall
 
You're just used to Texans , if there is a place on earth you figure women out it would have to be TX.







Stay thirsty my friends
 
when i went to college the texts were not composed with as much liberal agenda as they are today.......liberals were not trying to cram their ideology down our throats, albeit , i had a few who tried.That has changed intodays world!

secondly, i shouldn't have to pay college tuition, to be force fed liberal ideology.My time is better spent in classes where skills are taught that will better prepare me to be a wage earner. But someone, probably a liberal, says I have to take a philosophy class to become a civil engineer.
 
Well I am paying tuition for my daughter at an in state university and she is in her seconde year. She has not changed her political ideas much at all. The old saying that if you are 20 and not a liberal you don't have a heart but if you are 40 and not conservative you don't have a brain, applies.

It is up to us parents to teach kids about the world and to equip them with the skills to be critical readers and consumers of information. We try to give our kids skills to filter information through their own world view and arrive at their own decisions about what they believe.

So what you are saying is that what the real problem is that the problem is bad parents.

Nemont
 
Nemont is right. I remember when I was a kid I was a bit more liberal than I am now and that was simply because I had no idea how the real world works. I have tried to give my kids a good dose of what is right and what is wrong, and they are both conservative and still in high school. I doubt any limp wristed 440 type professor in college could sway them from their core beliefs.



"I'll admit it, that's hella funny! Good to see you around 202, I wish you would return on a regular basis there's a lot of bruised low lying fruit on here lately. You should be on here on a regular basis especially since it was your political carpet bombing at the campfire that inspired this forum!"
Thank you Forthewall
 
To not immerse your kids in different trains of thought and different ideologies like they receive in school and in thoughtful reading with parental guidance I believe is called a CULT!
 
>To not immerse your kids in
>different trains of thought and
>different ideologies like they receive
>in school and in thoughtful
>reading with parental guidance I
>believe is called a CULT!
>


.....so if you grew up in the 60's and your parents let you dabble in Timothy Leary's LSD experiments then that's ok with you.

that kind of thinking on this matter is what just prompted Obamma to put the mandate on the catholic church to provide their employees with BC and the day after pill...

problem with you lefties, is, you keep saying that conservatives are the one?s shoving religion down your throats when in actuality it's you shoving secularism down ours, so with your philosophy on life being rammed down our throat by you who think you know what's best for all, when all are different, put that mind set in error?

you definition of a cult is way off base there my friend, this is a cult, or perhaps you agree with Hitler?s ideas for our youth in America??


8849hitlers_youth.jpg


4229hitler-youth-burn-anti.jpg



Proverbs 22:6 American Standard Bible
Train up a child in the way he should go, Even when he is old he will not depart from it.

You show me a parent who takes their hands off their kids education and lifestyle and I'll show you a kid on drugs an sexually promiscuous
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-12 AT 01:18PM (MST)[p]My wife and I wanted our kids to understand that everything that comes to them in any kind of media there is an underlying agenda, even the Bible. Therefore we tried to equip them to be able to consume media, instruction, and other ideas and sort them out for themselves.

If you keep the world from you kids, then once they are out on their own they will pick almost all the worst things that are available. Sheltering your kids from divergent points of view and only presenting one side almost always leads to big problems down the road.

I don't know how you make the leap from teaching kids divergent views to Hitler. He viewed the world in black and white, in us vs. them. There were no divergent views allowed in Hitler's Germany, that is the opposite of what education means.

Seems like George Herbert Walker Bush, GWB, Mitt Romney all came from liberal Ivy League schools. Ronald Reagan was a new dealer, the head of a union, who converted to being a Republican as he got older. Marco Rubio graduated with a JD from University of Miami and BA from the University of Florida, two very liberal institutions. Newt Gringrich not only attending a liberal school in Brussels Belgium, he also was on staff at a very liberal school West Georgia College, he also got a deferrment from serving during the Vietnam war.

Go down the list of conservative leaders, young or old, almost all of them hold degrees and advanced degrees and all of them were able to become or stay conservative. It is what is inside that matters.

So consider this when trying to protect your kids from knowledge, telling only one side of the story makes them vunerable to the other side:


Family Life Council says it's time to bring family back to life

By Jon Walker

ST. LOUIS (BP)--In the course of researching family life in America, the Southern Baptist Council on Family Life uncovered such gut-wrenching statistics that they were driven to their knees.

Among the facts they found:

-- 88 percent of the children raised in evangelical homes leave church at the age of 18, never to return.

-- The divorce ratio among members of evangelical churches is virtually the same as among non-church members.

-- In the United States, 1 million children see their parents divorce.

-- Approximately two-thirds of the members of Southern Baptist churches attend church only sporadically.

-- Personal bankruptcies are at an all-time high in America.

-- The majority of children in America have less than 10 minutes of significant and meaningful conversation with their parents each week. If you remove the mother, you can measure this statistic in seconds.
 
Manny I'm going to be nice because you are getting hit from every side an I'm sure you're a little punch drunk.

I have one questions why did you leave out the with parental guidance part of my post? Those are very important words and change the whole context. Perhaps it is your poor reading comprehension if that is the case I forgive you, if not I await your apology.

"To not immerse your kids in different trains of thought and different ideologies like they receive in school and in thoughtful reading with "PARENTAL GUIDANCE" I believe is called a CULT! "(ME)
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-12 AT 05:08PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-12 AT 05:06?PM (MST)

LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-12 AT 04:40?PM (MST)

Nemont

Of course some high profile political conservatives go to liberal colleges where liberal ideology is being taught.Not many other choices! It's no secret that the majority of colleges employ liberal professors who in turn determine content and curiculm. My point is, neither liberal or conservative agendas should be taught in universities. Universities should not be political platforms. Kids will have there exposure to politics at other venues. Some will choose there positions, while many, simply won't care.

As far as my kids are concerned, I will never and I mean never teach them that radical liberal ideology produces positive outcomes......that goverment will solve their problems.

My kids are far from being sheltered. Every time they turn on the TV they get indoctrinated by this crap compliments of liberal hollywood. Even on kid TV like Nick and disney they are sending kids the wrong message. You have icarly where the older brother is raising a sister and he basicly never works and is a totally iresponsible dead beat.You have wizards of waverly place where the parents are characterized as morons that the kids walk all over and disrespect.Hanah Montana & on deck with zack and cody, where the parents are all single parent who are also characterized as morons. If anyone is sheletered it's kids raised in liberal house holds. These kids wouldn't know what a consevative idea was if they saw it in broad day light. Bottom line is, kids are very impressionable at a young age and complacent parenting is not the answer. It's a full time job correcting all the falsehoods the main stream media projects into americas living room.Almost every problem we face in america can be traced back to the disintegration of the family."No other success should compensate for failure in the home"

Cornhusker, i'd rather immerse my kids with facts rather than fiction.
 
Wow, Cabin dude? I wish I could articulate my thoughts in that manner and couldn't agree more?Thanx


Corn?

You know I'm beginning to think I just don't understand secular society any more, cause I'm not sure why I'm supposed to apologize, I'm not to proud to do so but I would like to get some comprehension on the subject first, you made a vague but broad statement of what you felt was considered a cult and I showed you what I know as a cult.

You must think I've spent my entire life in a religious, secluded life form, which is far from the truth, yes, I became a Born Again Christian at the young age of 13, but after two years of high school I decided to taste the fruit of rebellion, sex, parties and booze ect: only problem was it didn't stop there, by the end of 1977 I was shooting cocaine into my veins, when one day God sent an actual angel to call me back to him? call it an hallucination or what ever, don't matter, I know what I saw and heard?

So I have seen the other side of the coin of which many here, the life they live?
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-12 AT 05:53PM (MST)[p] This is some funny stuff to read. you guys talk as if a kid turns out not to be a wingnut you've failed as a parent and the kid may as well be put down.

Some of the most successful and happy people in america would be considered liberal, it's not a fault or a sin dispite your opinion.

I was raised and still live in as redneck of a place as you can find west of the divide and it showed until I turned maybe 35. guns, girls, wiskey, horses and pickups were all life was about, I had no tolerance for anyone who didn't look like me or think like me to the point I didn't care if they lived or not.

As I got older I learned everything is not black and white, few things are absolute right or wrong and few things are as simple as they seem to the young or ignorant.


As I near 50 I may not be smarter but I'm wiser, everyone is going to be who they are based on what's inside them. I've become much more liberal and with no outside influence whatsoever, and I'm happier than I've ever been. the middle is a comfortable place to be.

If I had kids I'd let them choose their own path because that's where they're going to end up anyway.





Stay thirsty my friends
 
Cabin try to tell your kids what to think and you get one of two things submissive worthless kids that can't and won't think when you're not around. If this doesn't happen they will totally rebel and join some group you don't like and hang out with friends you don't like. After nearly 35 years believe me I've seen it a lot, the girls that always end up pregnant are the Bible Beaters kids. College is often a disaster for them as well as they get in with groups the parents don't approve of. I discussed everything from politics, religion, government with my kids we often didn't agree. They grew up to be thinking adults.

You guys act like all liberals are the scum of the earth Manny and Cabin I believe you can't grasp that everything isn't black and white. My son and daughter are both similiar to me politically although probably a little closer to liberal. In your eyes they would be liberal. My son is a published author in his field and taught at Berkley although he works in the private sector in geophysics. My daughter at 28 has her own company that employs 9 people. So get off your high horse it gets old. Liberals don't just take they contribute.

Manny I don't know where to start with you. It sounds like I was right in my previous post you didn't watch the films about what drugs will do to your brain. You see I didn't do any of the drugs of our age group as a result I still have a working brain. You don't even understand what is appropriate to publish on the internet. There is no reason to even try to explain your behavior.
 
>Cabin try to tell your kids
>what to think and you
>get one of two things
>submissive worthless kids that can't
>and won't think when you're
>not around. If this
>doesn't happen they will totally
>rebel and join some group
>you don't like and hang
>out with friends you don't
>like. After nearly 35
>years believe me I've seen
>it a lot, the girls
>that always end up pregnant
>are the Bible Beaters kids.
> College is often a
>disaster for them as well
>as they get in with
>groups the parents don't approve
>of. I discussed everything
>from politics, religion, government with
>my kids we often didn't
>agree. They grew up
>to be thinking adults.
>
>You guys act like all liberals
>are the scum of the
>earth Manny and Cabin I
>believe you can't grasp that
>everything isn't black and white.
> My son and daughter
>are both similiar to me
>politically although probably a little
>closer to liberal. In your
>eyes they would be liberal.
> My son is a
>published author in his field
>and taught at Berkley although
>he works in the private
>sector in geophysics. My
>daughter at 28 has her
>own company that employs 9
>people. So get off
>your high horse it gets
>old. Liberals don't just
>take they contribute.
>
>Manny I don't know where to
>start with you. It
>sounds like I was right
>in my previous post you
>didn't watch the films about
>what drugs will do to
>your brain. You see I
>didn't do any of the
>drugs of our age group
>as a result I still
>have a working brain. You
>don't even understand what is
>appropriate to publish on the
>internet. There is no
>reason to even try to
>explain your behavior.
>
>


thank you o wise one, your self righteous dribble has touched me...I stand by my last post

as far as your children go seems like a liberal raise a couple of liberal as which is your right under the constitution?

I reiterate: Quote? problem with you lefties, is, you keep saying that conservatives are the one?s shoving religion down your throats when in actuality it's you shoving secularism down ours, so with your philosophy on life being rammed down our throat by you who think you know what's best for all, when all are different, put that mind set in error?
 
It really is your fault Manny the drugs in your youth have destroyed the reasoning part of your brain. It happened quit a bit to your age group that dabbled in the hard stuff as you admitted. If you aren't on disability you should be so us liberals can take care of you.
 
>
>Nemont
>
>Of course some high profile political
>conservatives go to liberal colleges
>where liberal ideology is being
>As far as my kids are
>concerned, I will never and
>I mean never teach them
>that radical liberal ideology produces
>positive outcomes......that goverment will solve
>their problems.
>
> My kids are far from
>being sheltered. Every time they
>turn on the TV they
>get indoctrinated by this crap
>compliments of liberal hollywood. Even
>on kid TV like Nick
>and disney they are sending
>kids the wrong message. You
>have icarly where the older
>brother is raising a sister
>and he basicly never works
>and is a totally iresponsible
>dead beat.You have wizards of
>waverly place where the parents
>are characterized as morons that
>the kids walk all over
>and disrespect.Hanah Montana & on
>deck with zack and cody,
>where the parents are all
>single parent who are also
>characterized as morons. If anyone
>is sheletered it's kids raised
>in liberal house holds. These
>kids wouldn't know what a
>consevative idea was if they
>saw it in broad day
>light. Bottom line is, kids
>are very impressionable at a
>young age and complacent parenting
>is not the answer. It's
>a full time job correcting
>all the falsehoods the main
>stream media projects into americas
>living room.Almost every problem we
>face in america can be
>traced back to the disintegration
>of the family."No other success
>should compensate for failure in
>the home"

Do you think I spend a single minute telling my kids the government is going to solve their problems? That is just stupid.

As for all the shows you mentioned, here is what I find absolutely stupid. 1. You obviously pay either a cable bill or have a dish that you pay for to pipe those shows to your house, 2. the Explosion of gay characters are a direct result of companies being able to rely on subsriptions to underwrite their programs and not be beholden to advertisers. So by paying for cable or dish service you are directly inviting those images into your home for your children to be exposed to and you are subsidizing the content on those programs.

You are as much a part of what is on TV as anybody if you do this. Go to almost any conservatives house and this holds true.

Nemont
 
You guys need to vote for Santorum, he says the destruction of the family can be traced back to when women started working. it really started when they got to vote but he figured he better not say that.

I hear Degeneres or however you spell her name got to keep her contract the queer haters were out to get cancelled. she seems like an evil person, always saying be kind to each other and crap like that. don't let kids learn tolerance or they won't know who they should hate, that would be tough on a lot of the conservative agenda .



Stay thirsty my friends
 
cornhusker

You are a product of your environment, just as your kids are.Still, it sounds like they turned out good and you have every right to be proud. We are not as far apart on this issue of raising kids as you may think. I'd argue that it is virtually impossible to shelter kids in this era of media madness.

I have a brother in law that is as liberal as 440 & piper, yet we get along very well. We have a good time arguing politics. I don't think he's the scum of the earth, but I do believe his ideologies are a broken set of rules by which he lives by.He is an aspiring professor in Oregon who can't get a job, I am a successful businessman that employs over 50.He blames the goverment for his woes; I don't have any woes. He thinks goverment is the answer; I know goverment is the problem.

I teach my kids the relationship between choice and consequence and let them think and choose for themselves.My parents raised me and my 7 siblings (5 boys 2 girls) the same way. As adults, all 5 of us boys have successful business that employ a lot of people.The girls are doing fine too. All of us have successful marriages, zero alcholics in the family, none of our kids (22 nieces and nephews) are on drugs, none of my brothers have financial problems.We certainly aren't a perfect family, but overall we are all very happy with our lives and the direction they are heading.

I know we all get in some heated arguments, but at the end of the day I'd take anyone of you guys to lunch (440,piper,cornhusker,nemont). So long as you didn't mind eating crow:)Seriously though, I have no animosity towards anyone on this form.
 
Cabin I do agree with how you were raised and we aren't that far apart. I can tell you have become a contributing member to society which is what we all hope for in our kids.

My point is we have a lot of reactionaries in this area and nation wide that won't allow their kids to read books that have anything controversial in them. These aren't 7 and 8 year old kids but 14-18. They also limit what they watch on TV. I show 10 minutes of CNN Student News daily, hardly left wing propaganda, that receives criticism.

Its almost always a failure when they go to a university or college. Many don't leave town. My area has many of the most conservative people on welfare. They won't go get skills to get a job, and less farmhand labor is used on the farms. The result is they might go to a junior college we have 45 miles away be afraid of the big bad city of 20,000, their back in mom and dad's safety still at 30.

Many have gone overboard on not allowing kids to think and as a result many don't. Those that have been overly sheltered usually rebel if they go to college.

A girl I taught 3 years ago got into Harvard and is in the top 5%, her entrance essay. "When I learned Diversity is Part of America." Her parents very much strict evangelical fundamentalist felt learning anything different was bad. She broke the mold, although she is as conservative as anyone on here. She could now at least reason both sides.

She gave me a framed copy of her entrance essay. It was about the last two years in my class and when she first learned everyone in her world wasn't a conservative, that moderates actually exist and really aren't that scary.

(Begin the smack down I expect it).
 
"Do you think I spend a single minute telling my kids the government is going to solve their problems? That is just stupid."

Nope Nemont, you just vote and support liberals who believe in Big goverment.Your actions as a parent speak volumes about what you believe.

Unfortunately, with cable and dish everything comes in a bundle so you have to take the good with the bad.Come on Nemont, you know that!Dish and Cable TV is like panning for gold. You have to sift through a lot of crap to find the small flecks of gold (i.e. history channel, outdoor channel....)

So are you saying you agree with the messages that hollywood is broadcasting to the kids is a positive one? Quit giving hollwood a pass.

You must be homophobic or the opposite, because I never mentioned anything about gay characters. But since you mentioned it, I'm tired of them craming their ideology down my throat as well.
 
Now you know how I vote. I bet I have as conservative of a voting record as you do.

I was making a point that if you pay for cable you are funding not only the gay agenda but you are doing it by removing the thing that used to make TV producers think twice, the advertising dollar. I really don't care if cable is bundled or not, if you pay a subscription fee for cable or dish part of that subscription goes to support not only the liberal agenda in content but the gay and lesbian characters on TV. You are paying for them to force it down you throat, no pun intended.

I don't agree with almost anything produced in Hollywood. I also know that with everything my kids will be exposed to it whether I agree with it or not. So I have tried to teach my kids that EVERY source of media has a bias, whether it is Disney or FoxNews or ESPN.

Just because one believes in teaching their kids about the world as it is not as they wish it would be does not make one a flaming liberal.

I don't want much TV as I am busy with alot of other things so I don't buy cable or dish as I can find what I want to watch on the internet now. I don't have pay for a bundle of channels that I don't really want and most of it is not worth watching anyway.


Nemont
 
cornhusker

I agree, it is good for kids to be engaged in controversial topics, so long as both sides are equally represented. Unfortunately, many times only one side is represented. If we want kids to process and take a stand on the issues, all sides need to be represented for them to make an educated decsion. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you do this with your students. I know for a fact that not all teachers do this. Infact, I'd wager most don't.

I think secondary education is a little over rated. It teaches young adults to be wage earners and live with in the status quo. Don't get me wrong, a person ought to get as much education as they can through whatever source they can, but it is not always going to result in a good job, or even a job at all. The year I graduated, the population of my town was about 4,000. Most in my graduating class left our town to seek there fortune through higher education. Mean while, I stuck around, got a modest college degree at a junior college and created one of the most successful & profitable business in our town now presently at around 16,000. My wifes aunt and her sister created a kitchen table business 20 years ago that today has a 100 million net worth, and employs several 100 empoloyees nation wide. Neither women went to a day of college. Are we teaching kids that higher education isn't always the answer to be successful in business. I'll bet not to many liberal teachers are serving up that school of thought.

That sounds like a proud moment with your Harvard student. I congratulate you.A teachers real payday is when they see their students become successful.

No smack down here. I just don't think that a person has to go to a big college or the big city to learn to think for themselves.
 
Nemont

I think we share a lot of the same values in raising our kids.

There are only 3-4 channels I watch with my basic dish bundle, yet I have to pay for all the crap too. It's like buying a bag of MM's with intention of eating only the green ones.

My kids know how the world is, after all they live in it. As a parent, I teach them to rise above it, and to not settle for medocrity.

For the record, I never said you were a flaming liberal. Truth is, I agree with the bulk of your last post. We are just arriving at the same destination via different routes.
 
I agree we send way too many people to 4 year colleges just so they can go. I worked a couple of years with a residential construction company after college and then bought up 25% of the company after a couple of years we broke the company up. I went into teaching and it has been enjoyable to me. I'm glad with this economy not to be in construction. Kids really need to think about what college will do for them before dumping a bunch of money on college for a degree that won't get them a job. That was one thing I insisted with my kids a useful degree not just 4 years or more of college.
 

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