Conservation Tag Conspiracy

Vanilla said:
Correct!


But that aside, had you been paying attention to this back in 2014-16 you’d know that there has been oodles of information out there.

I get it. You believe in the mission of MDF and support its causes. I think that’s great. Take away this one issue, the absolute sham awarding of the expo tags, I’ve got no issue with MDF. SFW isn’t in the same boat, I’ve got lots of beef with them. Although I think Troy has done a lot to bring them in line with the mainstream hunter rather than pushing the corporate and wealthy that would end public hunting in general narrative like the prior d bags did. But I’ve got no issue with the vast majority of what MDF does and certainly no problem with the rank and file.

But Slam, with all due respect, no less than 5 times this week on this topic I’ve pointed out things you believed and posted were cold hard facts were actually factually incorrect. You’ve got to be figuring out by now that you might not be getting the full picture from your sources. You should take Hawkeye up on his offer. But also read the links I provided for you if you really want to know why I call BS. It would take WAAAAAY too much time to rehash all this again on here. Just read the first hash.
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If Slam spends an afternoon with Hawkeye and keeps an open mind, he will become an Expo hater/boycotter like the rest of us.
The truth will set you free!
 
slamdunk said:
But why are people trying so hard to convince me I'm involved with a legal sham?
Who am I to those?
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No one is trying to convince you, you just take everything personal. You go on the attack and when people reply you get upset and go down a road of trying to prove them wrong. It gets even worse because your reading comprehension isn’t the best, likely due to your emotions.

None of us are getting out of this alive, have a happy holiday and a new year!
 
Vanilla said:
I can only speak for me, but it’s not about convincing you that you are involved in a legal sham. It’s much more about responding to claims being made that are not accurate.

And I’m certainly not trying to attack you. You shouldn’t feel the need to defend yourself. It’s just a discussion.
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Thank you.

But this brings me back to my question.

If the things I literally take from MDF and or DNR pages are incorrect, how are they still operating this "sham" (for lack of better terms).

I have a handful of people debating me, yet 60k happy people attending annually and crushing records of attendance and money raised?

5 people are right when tens of thousands are blind?
 
MrShane said:
If Slam spends an afternoon with Hawkeye and keeps an open mind, he will become an Expo hater/boycotter like the rest of us.
The truth will set you free!
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No I won't, because it didn't involve me nor affect me back then.

It affects me now, and all in a positive way.
 
slamdunk said:
Thank you.

But this brings me back to my question.

If the things I literally take from MDF and or DNR pages are incorrect, how are they still operating this "sham" (for lack of better terms).

I have a handful of people debating me, yet 60k happy people attending annually and crushing records of attendance and money raised?

5 people are right when tens of thousands are blind?
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Yeah cuz those 60k people all check MM’s. Good grief.

This goes back to your lack of understanding what is being shown to you. You have blinders on. If you took the time to read and understand what people are telling you it will all become clear to you.

We all jump to conclusions sometimes. It happens. No one is attacking you. Except me. I’m attacking you.
 
MrShane said:
Why do I despise the Expo?
Not only do I believe the tags the Expo are given are stolen from the public,
but The Expo did to hunting what the Olympics did to Utah.
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False.

They weren't "stolen from the public".

How can they be stolen from the public and still be available for public draw?
And an additional opportunity to draw that wasn't there before?

"Reallocation", not "stolen".

Don't give me the points creep speal either, that's pure BS.
Points creep hurts OIL more than anything else, yet with Expo tags, we get TWO draw systems, and one doesn't require points to draw, but uses them if and when you do.
Two public opportunities to draw a sheep tag?
Help me understand where that hurts the GP?

My daughter drew a great elk tag at Expo, killed a monster bull last year.
She's got 14 elk points and could draw that same tag again this year from the general draw.
Two great Utah elk tags in a lifetime?
How is that a bad thing?
How many will you draw on our current system?

Do you realize how much guaranteed conservation dollars that one $5 tag brought versus the general draw at $10 per applicant?
I have zero doubt that one late season Manti bull tag brought more money at Expo than it did on the general draw.
And even more, those Expo dollars generated go directly to conservation projects versus the $10 tags that go into a general fund.
 
MrShane said:
If Slam spends an afternoon with Hawkeye and keeps an open mind, he will become an Expo hater/boycotter like the rest of us.
The truth will set you free!
Click to expand...
I know you and others debating me don't care, but my involvement with Expo extends well beyond a standard Saturday patronage.

I am both a staff member of MDF and the Expo itself.
I work from the Wednesday night MDF kickoff party, the Expos Thursday night party, all 3 evening banquets, the ladies only banquet and judge the Elk Calling contest.
In my spare time, I am in the MDF booth.

So yes.....I am quite vested and love what I do.
No one will sway me to jump ship because of something that happened prior to my involvement.
 
slamdunk said:
No one will sway me to jump ship because of something that happened prior to my involvement.
Click to expand...

For me it was more about education than trying to get you to jump ship. It seemed your questions posed and concerns laid out were sincere.

Oh well. The info is there for you if you ever end up wanting it.
 
slamdunk said:
False.

They weren't "stolen from the public".

How can they be stolen from the public and still be available for public draw?
And an additional opportunity to draw that wasn't there before?

"Reallocation", not "stolen".

Don't give me the points creep speal either, that's pure BS.
Points creep hurts OIL more than anything else, yet with Expo tags, we get TWO draw systems, and one doesn't require points to draw, but uses them if and when you do.
Two public opportunities to draw a sheep tag?
Help me understand where that hurts the GP?

My daughter drew a great elk tag at Expo, killed a monster bull last year.
She's got 14 elk points and could draw that same tag again this year from the general draw.
Two great Utah elk tags in a lifetime?
How is that a bad thing?
How many will you draw on our current system?

Do you realize how much guaranteed conservation dollars that one $5 tag brought versus the general draw at $10 per applicant?
I have zero doubt that one late season Manti bull tag brought more money at Expo than it did on the general draw.
And even more, those Expo dollars generated go directly to conservation projects versus the $10 tags that go into a general fund.
Click to expand...
Reallocating tags to benefit an event a special interest group puts on is theft in my eyes. Allowing your favorite group to turn in a bid late and lock in a huge long term contract is corruption. Auctioning a tag that could be drawn by the general public is huge theft. And if .89 of a dollar goes to helping our piss poor deer population (that was piss poor before last winter’s big die off and many years prior) then it sounds like they are .11 short on every dollar to enhance wildlife IMO.
 
Vanilla said:
For me it was more about education than trying to get you to jump ship. It seemed your questions posed and concerns laid out were sincere.

Oh well. The info is there for you if you ever end up wanting it.
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I do appreciate it and I will most definitely learn some things my peers may or may not want me to know.

It is my right to know regardless of feelings I may hurt or even insult.

I can't stress enough how biased I am to one entity, just not the other.
The latter is where we can mutually agree.

Thank you Vanilla, I do respect you, your position/stance on this and on others as well.
 
EASY There wstrntines!

You're Starting To Sound Like Me Using The:

PISS POOR DEER HERD!

There's A bunch In Here That'll BAWL & WHINE!





wstrntines said:
Reallocating tags to benefit an event a special interest group puts on is theft in my eyes. Allowing your favorite group to turn in a bid late and lock in a huge long term contract is corruption. Auctioning a tag that could be drawn by the general public is huge theft. And if .89 of a dollar goes to helping our piss poor deer population (that was piss poor before last winter’s big die off and many years prior) then it sounds like they are .11 short on every dollar to enhance wildlife IMO.
Click to expand...
 
slamdunk said:
I know you and others debating me don't care, but my involvement with Expo extends well beyond a standard Saturday patronage.

I am both a staff member of MDF and the Expo itself.
I work from the Wednesday night MDF kickoff party, the Expos Thursday night party, all 3 evening banquets, the ladies only banquet and judge the Elk Calling contest.
In my spare time, I am in the MDF booth.

So yes.....I am quite vested and love what I do.
No one will sway me to jump ship because of something that happened prior to my involvement.
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Wait….what…?
Ladies Only banquet??
You just went up my respect ladder!
 
elkassassin said:
Every F'N Year!

About This Time Of Year!

This Same Sshit Shows Up!
Click to expand...

Bessy, you love the expo. We’ve given these groups how many millions for “conservation.” (Measured in factors of ten!)

How is that manifesting in the deer herds? You like the return we are getting on the investment? Should we just keep doing the same stuff?
 
Hey Niller?

Do I Need To High-Light It For You?

This Same Sshit Shows Up!

Nothing Ever Changes Other Than The Money Generated!



Vanilla said:
Bessy, you love the expo. We’ve given these groups how many millions for “conservation.” (Measured in factors of ten!)

How is that manifesting in the deer herds? You like the return we are getting on the investment? Should we just keep doing the same stuff?
Click to expand...
 
elkassassin said:
Hey Niller?

Do I Need To High-Light It For You?

This Same Sshit Shows Up!

Nothing Ever Changes Other Than The Money Generated!
Click to expand...

I agree. But you’re part of that! Same old same old. How’s that working out?

You happy with the return in “conservation” with all this money generated?
 
elkassassin said:
I'm Not Happy with All Of It,No!

But Show Me Who Else Is Doing Anything?

Except PISSING & MOANING!
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I kill every Coyote I can.
I killed a Bear two years ago.
I carry a rifle everywhere I go in hopes of killing any Cougars I see.
I petition everyone I can to try and help start a Cougar bounty program.
I petition everyone I can to try to get the State to add Bears to the same list as Coyotes and Cougars.
I keep my eyes peeled to the road everywhere I drive to not add to the roadkill problem (100% successful/lucky to date).
 
MrShane said:
Wait….what…?
Ladies Only banquet??
You just went up my respect ladder!
Click to expand...
Lol.....it's going to be "Beachy" this year 🍹😎
Screenshot_20231220_201403_Gallery.jpg
 
Hey MrShane!

I Wasn't Singling Individuals Out!

I Was Talkin ORGANIZATIONS!

Ya!

We Gotta Protect The Front Bumper As Much As We Can!:D

Keep Shootin Them Yotes!

It's A Bigger Problem Than Most Realize!

MrShane said:
I kill every Coyote I can.
I killed a Bear two years ago.
I carry a rifle everywhere I go in hopes of killing any Cougars I see.
I petition everyone I can to try and help start a Cougar bounty program.
I petition everyone I can to try to get the State to add Bears to the same list as Coyotes and Cougars.
I keep my eyes peeled to the road everywhere I drive to not add to the roadkill problem (100% successful/lucky to date).
Click to expand...
 
I Have Called Or Tried Calling You Several Times!

I'm Wondering Now If They Don't Bring Some HOT BRUNES In & You're Always Busy?:D:D:D
 
MrShane said:
I kill every Coyote I can.
I killed a Bear two years ago.
I carry a rifle everywhere I go in hopes of killing any Cougars I see.
I petition everyone I can to try and help start a Cougar bounty program.
I petition everyone I can to try to get the State to add Bears to the same list as Coyotes and Cougars.
I keep my eyes peeled to the road everywhere I drive to not add to the roadkill problem (100% successful/lucky to date).
Click to expand...
Do you wear a condom?
 
Dont mind SS he doesn't like the fact that predators are a problem and fights about it if anyone claims they are. I am sure once the neonate study is complete and continues to point out that predators are a huge problem maybe he might wake up.
 
Once Again!

Until 50+ Issues Are Comprehended!

And Until Many Fixes Are Made!

Nothing Changes Other Than Getting Worse By The Year!

Blaming Just A Few Fixes Nothing!
 
cantkillathing said:
Dont mind SS he doesn't like the fact that predators are a problem and fights about it if anyone claims they are. I am sure once the neonate study is complete and continues to point out that predators are a huge problem maybe he might wake up.
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You’re talking out your butt. I believe predators are a major factor. The only difference is which ones, you say a 35 lb coyote. I say 3.5 million tards and counting. 7 billion people aka predators.
 
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When Our herds Are Down To Nothing But PISSCUTTERS The OPPOR-F'N-TUNISTS Will Still Be Screaming Their F'N Heads Off For More Opportunity!

Like I've Said Many A Times!

Just Open It Up To Year Around & Un-Limited & Get It Over With!

WTF Is The Difference In Between Finishing It Off Fast Versus Finishing It Off Slow?

There Hasn't Been Nor Will There Be Any Changes Made To Do What Needs Done To Help Fix It!
 
slamdunk said:
Thank you.

But this brings me back to my question.

If the things I literally take from MDF and or DNR pages are incorrect, how are they still operating this "sham" (for lack of better terms).

I have a handful of people debating me, yet 60k happy people attending annually and crushing records of attendance and money raised?

5 people are right when tens of thousands are blind?
Click to expand...


Drive by an Rc Willey on free hot dog day and 1,000 people will wait in line for an hour for a .50 hot dog.

If it's setting records attendance, then why do we need to use tag money to pay for administration? Is that what is/was sold to the sportsmen as the reason for giving up those tags?

What other convention in this state do we donate tags to for administration? None.

Bluntly. We are killing animals to pay for a party.

That party draws 60,000(the tags draw 99% of that) let them that own the party pay for the administration. You can't tell me the money isn't there.

It's 2023. I can order underwear on Amazon, and it will be delivered by 5 today. I can order breakfast and have it here in 30 min. I can buy cars online. I can see any freakish porn instantly. Hell I can argue with you right here in real time.


But I have to have John Bair on a microphone hawking tags for which MDF/sfw take a cut?

Do you tags at MDF banquets need John? I'll bet the majority are sold to someone on a phone. Why can't those tags do the same?

I keep saying it.

Why are we selling off/lotto off tags to pay for Sfw/MDF February party and meet and greet?

You all can do the exact same thing, and leave 100% in the system.

The truth is, the show, probably would survive, but the reality is, it wouldn't draw near 60k.
 
The truth is, the show, probably would survive, but the reality is, it wouldn't draw near 60k.
[/QUOTE]

You're exactly right, all those people just might there for an additional opportunity to draw a tag that they wouldn't have otherwise.
Like I mentioned before, I personally have 5 close people who have drawn Expo tags and all had great hunts they wouldn't have gotten through the general system.
This year will be my turn since I am now in a big dead zone with points🫰🙏😁

We use the "future expo auctioneer" Barry Albrecht for local banquets.
 
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Hey Hossy!

I'm HATED Because I Go To The EXPO!

I'm A PISS POOR GAMBLER I Guess!

I've Played The Odds Every Year & Lost Every Year!

I Coulda Continued On To Bendover Nevada & Drop My Losses Off There,But I Didn't!

I Don't F Around Waiting For The Doors To Open Just To See What's Inside Again Year After Year!

I Go In & Spend Part Of The Day To See A Few Friends,Some years I See Different Friends On Different Years!'

I'm Not In There Buying Misc BullShitt I Don't Need!

Ya!

I'm Part Of The Problem I Guess!

EDIT:

For I Have SINNED!

But At Least I Paid My Tithing!;)
 
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hossblur said:
But I have to have John Bair on a microphone hawking tags for which MDF/sfw take a cut?
Click to expand...

And all this time I thought Bair would have been doing it for free. You know, it’s for conservation! And he was a big part of all this “conservation” stuff and getting it to where it is. I learned in this thread he’s being paid, which is wild to me. I guess all this expo stuff is like in the Grinch, it’s “about a little bit more” than conservation.
 
Vanilla said:
And all this time I thought Bair would have been doing it for free. You know, it’s for conservation! And he was a big part of all this “conservation” stuff and getting it to where it is. I learned in this thread he’s being paid, which is wild to me. I guess all this expo stuff is like in the Grinch, it’s “about a little bit more” than conservation.
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I don't know if he is personally getting paid, but I know the auction banquets are extremely expensive.
 
slamdunk said:
Thank you.

But this brings me back to my question.

If the things I literally take from MDF and or DNR pages are incorrect, how are they still operating this "sham" (for lack of better terms).

I have a handful of people debating me, yet 60k happy people attending annually and crushing records of attendance and money raised?

5 people are right when tens of thousands are blind?
Click to expand...
Willful ignorance is not difficult to achieve. All it takes in this case is an almost non-existent chance at a tag and 60K will turn a blind eye.
 
slamdunk said:
The truth is, the show, probably would survive, but the reality is, it wouldn't draw near 60k.
Click to expand...

You're exactly right, all those people just might there for an additional opportunity to draw a tag that they wouldn't have otherwise.
Like I mentioned before, I personally have 5 close people who have drawn Expo tags and all had great hunts they wouldn't have gotten through the general system.
This year will be my turn since I am now in a big dead zone with points🫰🙏😁

We use the "future expo auctioneer" Barry Albrecht for local banquets.
[/QUOTE]

You draw, I'm joining SS team in attacking you😉😁
 
slamdunk said:
When I pay my $35 annually to RMEF, I am under the impression it goes towards Conservation of Elk, not to pay John Bair to Auction tags or to Ned LeDoux to do a concert on Saturday night.
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I guess this is where my confusion is slam. You said you know where the money is coming from and where it is going, that you work the expo, work the auctions, that you have inside info from the sources, and then tell us Bair is getting paid to auction tags. (That is certainly the implication with you post above questioning the RMEF expo model...which was one of only about 4-6 fallacies in your statements on the matter...) When I say that is surprising based upon his involvement with both SFW and the Wildlife Board, I get this...

slamdunk said:
I don't know if he is personally getting paid, but I know the auction banquets are extremely expensive.
Click to expand...

I think you over-extended here big time. You can comfortably assume these are the types of things that make me keep coming back. I've told myself two different times I was done with the topic, but you keep bringing me back in with this kind of stuff!

And there would certainly be nothing odd about a guy that was directly involved with creating, continuing to award the contract, and propagating the expo to be getting paid by it at the same time. Nothing odd about that at all. Nothing to see here. Just hearsay...

But now I have that question: Does John Bair get paid to run the auction? If so, I wonder how auditors would feel in a REAL audit about someone representing the government awarding a lucrative contract to utilize entirely public resources to a group that was paying him? Any red flags there? If he's not paid, and slam misspoke above, then all is well and I'm not worried about that aspect anymore. If he is paid, then I think we have more than hearsay once again to show just how dirty this whole process is.
 
hossblur said:
You're exactly right, all those people just might there for an additional opportunity to draw a tag that they wouldn't have otherwise.
Like I mentioned before, I personally have 5 close people who have drawn Expo tags and all had great hunts they wouldn't have gotten through the general system.
This year will be my turn since I am now in a big dead zone with points🫰🙏😁

We use the "future expo auctioneer" Barry Albrecht for local banquets.
Click to expand...

You draw, I'm joining SS team in attacking you😉😁
[/QUOTE]
I'll draw an Anthro tag and hire @elkassassin to guide me to a 3 point bull 😁
 
Vanilla said:
I guess this is where my confusion is slam. You said you know where the money is coming from and where it is going, that you work the expo, work the auctions, that you have inside info from the sources, and then tell us Bair is getting paid to auction tags. (That is certainly the implication with you post above questioning the RMEF expo model...which was one of only about 4-6 fallacies in your statements on the matter...) When I say that is surprising based upon his involvement with both SFW and the Wildlife Board, I get this...



I think you over-extended here big time. You can comfortably assume these are the types of things that make me keep coming back. I've told myself two different times I was done with the topic, but you keep bringing me back in with this kind of stuff!
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How or where did you ever insinuate that Bair was paid??
I have absolutely no knowledge of that, so why would I even assume he is or isn't?
It's not my business nor is it a concern of mine.

The only thing I have said about the auctions are that they are extremely expensive to put on.
The ballroom rental and 5 star meal, bagpipe bands, speakers, etc, etc.
As for Bair?
I have absolutely no clue on his role other than he's the man in black putting on an auction.

If you assumed he was paid, that's not on me, nor will I accept being belittled for it.
 
slamdunk said:
How or where did you ever insinuate that Bair was paid??
I have absolutely no knowledge of that, so why would I even assume he is or isn't?
It's not my business nor is it a concern of mine.

The only thing I have said about the auctions are that they are extremely expensive to put on.
The ballroom rental and 5 star meal, bagpipe bands, speakers, etc, etc.
As for Bair?
I have absolutely no clue on his role other than he's the man in black putting on an auction.

If you assumed he was paid, that's not on me, nor will I accept being belittled for it.
Click to expand...

Easy tiger, you're not being belittled. Check both quotes in my post. That quote is your words, not mine. Don't pass blame for something you wrote hoping to knock down RMEF just because that cuts both ways. You said your $35 RMEF membership fee would be going to pay John Bair. I didn't make that up. You said it. I can pretend you didn't, but then we'd both be wrong.

You're not being belittled, but you're certainly being questioned. However, you're only being questioned on the things you wrote, not anyone else.

Can you find out if MDF pays a portion of a fee to John Bair? I'd be interested to know that.
 
Vanilla said:
Easy tiger, you're not being belittled. Check both quotes in my post. That quote is your words, not mine. Don't pass blame for something you wrote hoping to knock down RMEF just because that cuts both ways. You said your $35 RMEF membership fee would be going to pay John Bair. I didn't make that up. You said it. I can pretend you didn't, but then we'd both be wrong.

You're not being belittled, but you're certainly being questioned. However, you're only being questioned on the things you wrote, not anyone else.
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Ok, I see that, my choice of wording....I apologize for making it sound like he is currently being paid.

Here's where I came up with that.
With his involvement with SFW, I always assumed he was a volunteer auctioneer, but have never inquired into it, nor do I care.
When I flipped the scenario to RMEF, I wouldn't assume he would be a "volunteer" for them.

I wasn't clear, I apologize.
I am at work when writing these during the day and usually fire off quick responses.

Just as my statement of "I know where the money comes from and where it goes".
Meaning....I help bring it in because I work the fundraising events and I also work the habitat projects.
Call it "vague".....I'm ok with that.
 
I already feel better about this with your clarification. But the discussion still piqued my interest on the topic of the day...
 
slamdunk said:
No one will sway me to jump ship because of something that happened prior to my involvement.
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This right here is why there is zero point discussing the issues with the Expo tags/contract process with you.

Phrased another way, 'those problems happened then, before my time, so why should I care?'

You should care because the ($millions) benefits enjoyed by MDF and SFW still to this day are predicated on those past problems. The process that resulted in SFW/MDF being chosen back in 2015-16 was egregious, and those entities are still profiting from that error.
 
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johnnycake said:
This right here is why there is zero point discussing the issues with the Expo tags/contract process with you.

Phrased another way, 'those problems happened then, before my time, so why should I care?'

You should care because the ($millions) benefits enjoyed by MDF and SFW still to this day are predicated on those past problems. The process that resulted in SFW/MDF being chosen back in 2015-16 was egregious, and those entities are still profiting from that error.
Click to expand...
100%

Would Slamdunk trust a pedophile alone around his future grandkids? I mean after all he shouldn’t care about the past.
 
Not sure how anyone can support organizations who perpetuate the fallacy of more conservation, convention and land owner tags than the compete rest of the country combined as a win for herds that are declining in the face of all their supposed 'work'.

All the while we the 'average hunter' have had to pay the price for this 'wealth tag' boondoggle in all it's forms over the last two and a half or so decades.

Shame on all you all who've been complicit in this bastardization of everything true and right about hunting as we've known it for generations :(
 
slamdunk said:
Hey @SS!, I can't see your posts unless someone comments on you, but I see this one.

You keep my grandkids out of your ******** mouth!!
Get it prik?
I'm done with your a$$, you better never cross my path.... ever!!!
Click to expand...
See you at the expo!
 
slamdunk said:
Hey @SS!, I can't see your posts unless someone comments on you, but I see this one.

You keep my grandkids out of your ******** mouth!!
Get it prik?
I'm done with your a$$, you better never cross my path.... ever!!!
Click to expand...
Name calling is against the rules. As a moderator you should know as much.
 
grizzly said:
You're out of line. Give it a rest.
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You’re right. I didn’t mean to hurt his feelings. I’m sorry @slamdunk. It was not a great hypothetical and I’m not afraid to own up to it. Again I’m sorry Slamdunk. You can keep sending the threats via PM. I have thick skin and handled the 8 already.
 
It’s amazing the amount of cowardly disrespect the internet has produced. Just think about that guy sitting at home by himself , behind a computer screen, typing whatever disrespectful bull **** he can think of, just to purposefully piss another person off, and smiling about it. What a life.
 
lif said:
It’s amazing the amount of cowardly disrespect the internet has produced. Just think about that guy sitting at home by himself , behind a computer screen, typing whatever disrespectful bull **** he can think of, just to purposefully piss another person off, and smiling about it. What a life.
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Almost as bad as people that watch sports!
 
Just curious?
Did RMEF sue DWR for wrongful action pertaining to the Expo contract or anything like that?
And if not, why?
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
slamdunk said:
No one will sway me to jump ship because of something that happened prior to my involvement.

Did you not type this?
Click to expand...
Yep sure did and I'll be at Expo all 4 days doing my thing.
I don't see any hypocrisy in that statement whatsoever.

Also, I'll be spending a lot of good quality time at Expo, banquets, parties, auctions, etc, etc with a very close friend who just happens to be the Utah RMEF Chair.
Imagine that!🤷‍♂️
 
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Vanilla said:
To be fair, MDF has been MUCH more open with their accounting than SFW. Or the state.

When you look at the three partners involved, the state, SFW, and MDF, MDF is by far the most transparent. Still not perfect, but they are in the lead.
Click to expand...
Thank you
 
Hey Niller?

How Mad & How Quick Did You Make PEAYDAY Mad?

Vanilla said:
To be fair, MDF has been MUCH more open with their accounting than SFW. Or the state.

When you look at the three partners involved, the state, SFW, and MDF, MDF is by far the most transparent. Still not perfect, but they are in the lead.
Click to expand...
 
And Which Tag Did You Pull?

Can You Imagine The TAGS You Would Of Drawn If You Had Been Nice?:D

Vanilla said:
It wasn’t long after calling him a liar in front of some legislators (and having them agree with me) that I drew a tag at HIS expo!

So I’m sure he was really mad. And I’ve been blacklisted ever since.
Click to expand...
 
Vanilla said:
It wasn’t long after calling him a liar in front of some legislators (and having them agree with me) that I drew a tag at HIS expo!

So I’m sure he was really mad. And I’ve been blacklisted ever since.
Click to expand...
I honestly can't stand even seeing that dude.
Now he's got Hunter Nation, but I know nothing about it nor is there much chatter about it.
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
Your saying MDF is and their accounting and accountability was no different than SFW's, was it not?
Click to expand...

No. That's not even close to true.

MDF is very transparent. Whether I agree with the tags or not, MDF doesn't play games with accounting, and comparing them to $fw is very unfair
 

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